User Tag List

123 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 49

  1. #1
    Senior Member BlackDog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    MBTI
    NiTe
    Enneagram
    9w8 so/sx
    Posts
    572

    Default Russian Occupation of Crimea

    I'm sure everyone has heard of this. In my opinion, I have a choice between believing that the U.S. media is reliable, or that both the Russian and U.S. media are unreliable. My instinct tells me that both are controlled. Probably there is no way of really knowing the situation in Ukraine; people believe just because they see a video clip that they know what is going on; what they don't realize is that the media has already set the parameters of their thinking about what they see. They see some guys with a tank; according to the media's slant they will see them as foreign aggressors or brave liberators protecting the ethnic Russian minority from the U.S.-backed coup leadership of Ukraine.

    Has anyone seen the clip where the RT anchor resigns on air because of RT's coverage? And the video where Piers Morgan is rattled because another RT anchor tells him that 90% of the U.S. media is owned by 6 corporations, and he responds with a platitude, and then she implies he is lying by talking about self-censorship in the corporate media? He responds angrily; it's a good clip. I choose to believe it is representative because I like to believe in corporate control and corruption; who can prove this wrong?

  2. #2
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    5,931

    Default

    They see some guys with a tank; according to the media's slant they will see them as foreign aggressors or brave liberators protecting the ethnic Russian minority from the U.S.-backed coup leadership of Ukraine.
    When it comes to politics, there's no black and white, just different shades of grey.

    J.P. Morgan once said "A man always has two reasons for doing anything: a good reason and the real reason", which definitely applies to Putin.


  3. #3
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,541

    Default War Among the People

    Nuclear weapons makes war between nations passé.

    But war among the people is now cool.

    We see this in the Ukraine where Ukrainians are fighting one another.

    We see this in the Middle East where they are fighting one another in a number of countries. We see this in Africa.

    And with Islamic migration we see terrorism among the people across the globe.

  4. #4
    Banned
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    MBTI
    ISTJ
    Posts
    85

    Default

    Big Russian population in the East including Crimea. The west's strongest political element is an ethnic nationalist flavor, so everyone is calling everyone an oy vey evil nazi! Best split the two and keep as many people alive as possible.

  5. #5
    Member JustAMind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    MBTI
    ?
    Enneagram
    ?
    Socionics
    ?
    Posts
    86

    Default

    I understand Russian POV, they can't afford to lose military presence in Crimea. If I was in charge of Russia I would do the same, protect my state's interest.
    Russia is of course hypocritical about this, they can't say it in the open so they make up some bogus reasons to intervene. Also they wouldn't be so eager to
    grant a referendum to Chechen people.

    At the same time UE/USA are on even higher level of hypocrisy. It's absurd how they say Russians broke international
    law, yet they support a government that has ZERO legitimacy. They support an illegal coup of democratic government(no matter how you'd rate the job they have done).
    Interestingly not long ago EU countries passed a law that allows them to call in police and military from other EU countries in similar situation. USA calls it unprecedented
    revision of boarders while they(NATO) did similar thing in Balkans, splitting Yugoslavia and giving independence to Kosovo. Also US invades wherever it wants for
    whatever made-up reason (vide Iraq).

    It's all game of thrones, there's no good and evil here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lion 4.5 View Post
    In my opinion, I have a choice between believing that the U.S. media is reliable, or that both the Russian and U.S. media are unreliable. My instinct tells me that both are controlled. Probably there is no way of really knowing the situation in Ukraine;
    I think the same.

  6. #6
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,041

    Default

    I'm ignoring the media and going on some hunches.

    Ukraine is in the Russian sphere of influence. Crimea is in a warmer area which is advantageous to Russia. Russia neither wants to lose influence of Ukraine nor give up that influence to EU or the U.S because this is disadvantageous to Russia as a whole. As a nation with influence of other countries, it is not advantageous to let them go because another nation decided to influence it through other means.

    The EU, the United States, and their respective media, favor the anti-government because it would be another government that is in favor of their interest (doesn't matter if it is "democratic" or "free" or whatnot) and will do anything necessary to gain that influence. "National Interest" in this case is to influence another country in our terms.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Socionics
    ILI
    Posts
    1,838

    Default

    Methinks the majority of the Crimean that actually want to become part of Russia were born during the Soviet Era.

    Also, any bets for what country Russia decides to target next? So far we've had since 2008 Georgia and now Ukraine. (I bet on Kazakhstan)

  8. #8
    ndovjtjcaqidthi
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    Lol.

  9. #9
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    MBTI
    ENFJ
    Enneagram
    1w2 sp/so
    Socionics
    EIE Fe
    Posts
    7,989

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by JustAMind View Post
    I understand Russian POV, they can't afford to lose military presence in Crimea. If I was in charge of Russia I would do the same, protect my state's interest.
    Russia is of course hypocritical about this, they can't say it in the open so they make up some bogus reasons to intervene. Also they wouldn't be so eager to
    grant a referendum to Chechen people.

    At the same time UE/USA are on even higher level of hypocrisy. It's absurd how they say Russians broke international
    law, yet they support a government that has ZERO legitimacy. They support an illegal coup of democratic government(no matter how you'd rate the job they have done).
    Interestingly not long ago EU countries passed a law that allows them to call in police and military from other EU countries in similar situation. USA calls it unprecedented
    revision of boarders while they(NATO) did similar thing in Balkans, splitting Yugoslavia and giving independence to Kosovo. Also US invades wherever it wants for
    whatever made-up reason (vide Iraq).

    It's all game of thrones, there's no good and evil here.
    This is a very fair analysis. I'm rather glad that the US has largely kept out of it up to this point (and I hope they continue to do so). Considering what we have done as a nation over the past decade, we have absolutely no ground to stand on when we call Russia on their B.S.. We're just calling the kettle black. If we do actually take a major step into this, it will make the entire situation worse. Not only do we not handle that stuff well in recent times, it will open an entire dialouge the world over on the hypocrisy over what we'd be doing.

    All I can do (and hope) is that this ends up working out. IMO I would like to see Ukraine become part of the EU as it will help them get a firm standing over the next few years. It seems like the culture there would handle it well and approach it with open arms. Sadly, there are enough dissenters that it might just rapidly destabalize and fail. For now, we can just hope for the best and that everyone makes the best decisions that they can.



    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    Methinks the majority of the Crimean that actually want to become part of Russia were born during the Soviet Era.
    This is really important, and it's kind of surprising that it's not really being talked about that much. The ethnic history of Crimea is majority russian, and it stands to reason that there is a majority there that would like to be part of Russia. I wonder if any polling data was ever taken on this. If this it the case then it should be talked about between the two. Of course, it wouldn't likely go over well.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
    Functions: Fe > Te > Ni > Se > Si > Ti > Fi > Ne
    Enneagram: 1w2 - 3w4 - 6w5 (The Taskmaster) | sp/so
    Socionics: β-E dimer | -
    Big 5: slOaI
    Temperament: Choleric/Melancholic
    Alignment: Lawful Neutral
    External Perception: Nohari and Johari


  10. #10
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Socionics
    ILI
    Posts
    1,838

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    This is really important, and it's kind of surprising that it's not really being talked about that much. The ethnic history of Crimea is majority russian, and it stands to reason that there is a majority there that would like to be part of Russia. I wonder if any polling data was ever taken on this. If this it the case then it should be talked about between the two. Of course, it wouldn't likely go over well.
    I find it extremely coincidental that Russia's excursion in Crimea happened to be only 23-24 years after the dissolution of the Soviet Union and its satellite states, perhaps they are attempting to acquire the previous autonomous state while it still has those who were loyal to the Soviets and before the young (post 1991-1992) can actually voice their own opinion (which would most likely favor Ukraine).

Similar Threads

  1. Turkey downs Russian warplane near Syria border,Putin warns of "serious consequences"
    By Olm the Water King in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 11-26-2015, 06:27 PM
  2. The Israeli occupation of Palestine
    By figsfiggyfigs in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 46
    Last Post: 07-27-2011, 06:51 PM
  3. Title of this sector.
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 05-04-2007, 05:40 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO