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View Poll Results: What is the purpose of law?

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  • To enforce objective standards of right and wrong.

    0 0%
  • To facilitate social order.

    19 79.17%
  • I don't agree with the first two options, but I want to be included.

    5 20.83%
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  1. #21
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Then let me ask you this:

    Why would be wrong to prevent someone from hurting themselves? Say, keep them from drinking, or taking any other drugs. Keep them from comitting suicide.

    Also, would it be wrong to pressure someone to participate society? Why not have Fascism, for instance?
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  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Then let me ask you this:

    Why would be wrong to prevent someone from hurting themselves? Say, keep them from drinking, or taking any other drugs. Keep them from comitting suicide.

    Also, would it be wrong to pressure someone to participate society? Why not have Fascism, for instance?
    If you think I'm trying to weasel out of using the word morality, that isn't what I'm doing. What is the ultimate justification for morality? Something "just is" right or wrong? So what?

    Addiction and depression are illnesses so those people aren't really in control of themselves and need help. Fascism is a gorilla telling the little monkeys to scratch his back or he'll pull their heads off.

  3. #23
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    I would say that morality was evolutionarily born out of social pragmatism among a social species. So, in other words, even all concepts of social pragmatism can be classified as a moral code. Morals are as justified as anything. The logic you have to use to nullify them will also nullify the value of rationale, and urges, and all the other things that people generaly take for motivation or justification.
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  4. #24
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    Defining morals as those things ingrained in us by evolution since we are a social species, I can go with that. But using morals as a basis for prohibitive laws makes me nervous since there are a lot of moral issues people disagree on. Do we base our laws on the morality of the majority? It doesn't really matter what anyone wants, power always wins in the end.

  5. #25
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    I'm one of those d-bags who thinks that "the law is just there so that The Man can control us!"

  6. #26
    Reigning Bologna Princess Rajah's Avatar
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    The responses are conflating two questions: what is the purpose of law, and what does law actually do. These questions have some pretty significant differences.

    The answer to your question, "What is the purpose of law?" is more complex than your answer choices.

    Law is intended to create and maintain societal order. And it is intended to establish standards for right and wrong and mete out punishment accordingly. It is intended to punish the wrongdoer and to right wrongs by making an aggrieved person whole. It's way too complex a system for me to pick one thing it's meant to do.

    Incidentally, the answer choices asked whether law was intended to enforce objective standards of right and wrong, not whether it could actually do what it intended to do. Of course there can't be an objective standard. Humans are biased, period. But law attempts to get us to an objective standard, even though the best it can hope for is "as objective as possible."


    I... suppose. Yeah!

  7. #27
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rajah View Post
    The responses are conflating two questions: what is the purpose of law, and what does law actually do. These questions have some pretty significant differences.

    The answer to your question, "What is the purpose of law?" is more complex than your answer choices.

    Law is intended to create and maintain societal order. And it is intended to establish standards for right and wrong and mete out punishment accordingly. It is intended to punish the wrongdoer and to right wrongs by making an aggrieved person whole. It's way too complex a system for me to pick one thing it's meant to do.

    Incidentally, the answer choices asked whether law was intended to enforce objective standards of right and wrong, not whether it could actually do what it intended to do. Of course there can't be an objective standard. Humans are biased, period. But law attempts to get us to an objective standard, even though the best it can hope for is "as objective as possible."
    Yeah, you're right. (Btw, this sounds like the type of answer someone in the legal profession would give.) It's obvious that in our current legal system the intention is to do both, because it frequently does do both. In hindsight I probably should have phrased the question, "What do you think the purpose of law should be?" I posted the poll and such, because I wanted to hear everyone's opinion and why they thought that way.
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  8. #28
    Reigning Bologna Princess Rajah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    Btw, this sounds like the type of answer someone in the legal profession would give.
    I'm not surprised.


    I... suppose. Yeah!

  9. #29
    Reigning Bologna Princess Rajah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    Let's assume for the sake of argument that all killing is immoral. Therefore abortion would be immoral.
    This doesn't resonate for a large group of people, me included. Whether abortion is murder depends on whether you see a young fetus as alive. To get to your conclusion requires a gigantic assumption.


    I... suppose. Yeah!

  10. #30
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rajah View Post
    This doesn't resonate for a large group of people, me included. Whether abortion is murder depends on whether you see a young fetus as alive. To get to your conclusion requires a gigantic assumption.
    Not really. All you have to do is look at some human development photos.
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