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  1. #71
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    Two bland, vacant-eyed, middle-of-the-road socialists were put up by the Dems and Reps last election year. I predict therefore that 2016 will be the year of the wild-eyed extremists.

    It will be Hillary Clinton vs. Rand Paul.
    Hillary Clinton and Rand Paul could hardly be considered Socialists, especially considering I would believe the banking industry will be backing Hillary because of what Bill Clinton did to help them. The Banks that do align with Hillary will surely get the help of the financial sector. I don't know specifically about Rand Paul, but I would think he is more of a Civil Libertarian on Social Issues and well.... less regulatory statutes on economic issues too. The only reason why I like him is the image he puts up as a Civil Libertarian.

    Hillary, I can bet will very much be like Obama or Bill Clinton. Moderate, sometimes moving a little left and sometimes moving a little right. If there was really any reason to vote for her, it might just be because she is a woman.

    That Guy from New Jersey still has a chance since he sounds so moderate.... like every other candidate (whether it is a facade or not.)

  2. #72
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rail Tracer View Post
    Hillary Clinton and Rand Paul could hardly be considered Socialists, especially considering I would believe the banking industry will be backing Hillary because of what Bill Clinton did to help them. The Banks that do align with Hillary will surely get the help of the financial sector. I don't know specifically about Rand Paul, but I would think he is more of a Civil Libertarian on Social Issues and well.... less regulatory statutes on economic issues too. The only reason why I like him is the image he puts up as a Civil Libertarian.

    Hillary, I can bet will very much be like Obama or Bill Clinton. Moderate, sometimes moving a little left and sometimes moving a little right. If there was really any reason to vote for her, it might just be because she is a woman.

    That Guy from New Jersey still has a chance since he sounds so moderate.... like every other candidate (whether it is a facade or not.)
    I stated that Hillary Clingon and Rand Paul Rand are wild-eyed extremists, not socialists. Hillary Clingon will play "politics as usual," Rand Paul Rand will try to play the honesty card.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  3. #73
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    I stated that Hillary Clingon and Rand Paul Rand are wild-eyed extremists, not socialists. Hillary Clingon will play "politics as usual," Rand Paul Rand will try to play the honesty card.
    How does one play politics as usual as a wild eyed extremist?
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  4. #74
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    I stated that Hillary Clingon and Rand Paul Rand are wild-eyed extremists, not socialists. Hillary Clingon will play "politics as usual," Rand Paul Rand will try to play the honesty card.
    Opps, my bad. Still, the ACA could hardly be considered socialist XD. It is a whole middle-of-the-road-trying-to-make-everyone-happy thing that pisses most people off.

    And honestly... Obama is fairly moderate in presidential standards. He honestly hasn't stood out much besides being the first black president.

    Everything else is just political mudslinging.

  5. #75
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    How does one play politics as usual as a wild eyed extremist?
    Look at the presidential campaigns of the last half century. The candidates start their campaigns at the extremes and end up more moderate.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  6. #76
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rail Tracer
    And honestly... Obama is fairly moderate in presidential standards. He honestly hasn't stood out much besides being the first black president.
    Is dishonesty and corruption considered "moderate" these days? This administration and president is more corrupt and dishonest than Nixon. Nixon targetted a few political enemies; Obama got the IRS to target over a hundred organizations and collect phone data on a hundred million Americans. Now he wants the FCC to monitor news organizations for bias and proper reporting of the important issues, lol. There is nothing moderate about adding $7 trillion to the debt or taking over 1/6th of the economy through Obamacare. He's your standard tax and spend liberal and liberals are not moderate.
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  7. #77
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    I predict the winner will be a dishonest populist, a secret atheist pretending to be a christian, and thoroughly corrupt. Great things will be expected of him/her, but progess will be slow, and regress unavoidable. Then a great storm will arise and rain, rain, rain will wash it all away; and its name will be Death, and hell will followed with him.


  8. #78
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    From the National Journal: Rand Paul Is the GOP's Early Presidential Front-Runner

    While the establishment hopes for a governor to emerge, he is quietly putting together a formidable operation.

    Republican strategists like to say the party's next nominee needs to hail from the GOP's gubernatorial ranks. It's a response to how unpopular Washington is—particularly the party's congressional wing—and a reflection of the party's strength in holding a majority of governorships. But another reason for the gubernatorial focus is to sidestep the one formidable candidate that gives the establishment heartburn: Sen. Rand Paul.

    Make no mistake: The Kentuckian scares the living daylights out of many Republicans looking for an electable nominee capable of challenging Hillary Clinton. At the same time, he's working overtime to broaden the party's image outside its traditional avenues of support. The 2016 Republican nominating fight will go a long way toward determining whether Paul is the modern version of Barry Goldwater or at the leading edge of a new, more libertarian brand of Republicanism.

    "That's the big challenge—is America ready? I think that Rand and his small-L libertarian Republicanism can break through," said Paul's longtime adviser Jesse Benton. "He's a fundamentally better messenger than Barry Goldwater—[Goldwater's 1964 campaign slogan] 'In your heart you know he's right' is not very compelling. Rand is a wonderful communicator, and I think a message of individual liberty can build wide support."

    Either way, Paul's brand of politics is a distinct departure from the party's traditional moorings. His occasional sympathy for Edward Snowden puts him on an island within the party. His critique of the National Security Agency's domestic surveillance techniques and noninterventionist views on foreign policy are gaining some conservative followers, but are still outside the party mainstream. Many conservative foreign policy hawks could sooner support Clinton than Paul in a 2016 matchup.

    And he's got a history of questionable associations and controversial comments that would make Democratic opposition researchers salivate. Whether it's hiring a top aide who was a former secessionist talk-show host (and defending him amid controversy), questioning the legality of the 1964 Civil Rights Act during his Senate campaign, or facing allegations of plagiarism from past speeches, Paul's got plenty of controversies poised to reemerge in a presidential campaign. Paul's invocation of Bill Clinton's affair with Monica Lewinsky to attack Hillary Clinton in recent weeks is classic Paul—throw red meat into the fire to energize the base, regardless of the political consequences.

    At the same time, Paul has been doing more than almost any other Republican to expand the party's appeal to nontraditional GOP voters—the type of activity that's imperative for future success. He spoke at Howard University and historically black Simmons College in Kentucky (twice) as part of an outreach effort toward African-Americans. His Jack Kemp-like pitch for "economic freedom zones" has even drawn the interest of the NAACP, which invited him to speak. He's been leading the call for reforming drug sentencing, an issue that's won support from many young voters and minorities who disproportionately bear the burden of current zero-tolerance policy. This week, at a Missouri Republican Party banquet, he said the party needs "a more diverse party—with tattoos and without tattoos."

    Meanwhile, the politics of the 2016 Republican nomination look increasingly favorable to Paul. He is one of the top fundraisers in the field, has a ready-made base of support from his father's presidential networks, and has proven his savvy political instincts with a made-for-TV drone filibuster and NSA lawsuit. The newly compressed Republican presidential calendar should benefit a Paul candidacy, since he's got the grassroots support to play in the small states and the money to fight forward in the big media-market states that follow.

    Paul's mutually beneficial alliance with Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, who faces reelection this year, is a prime example of his political foresight. McConnell has helped him build chits with the establishment, including donors skeptical of his national viability. McConnell, meanwhile, has gotten tea-party validation to get him through a contested primary against businessman Matt Bevin. He's also benefited from Paul's swipes at former President Clinton, who is emerging as an important surrogate for McConnell's Democratic challenger, Alison Lundergan Grimes. McConnell, if he survives the general election, could become the next majority leader. But Paul, in taming the establishment skepticism toward him, could end up with the bigger prize.

    "He is the Republican front-runner," said Republican strategist Scott Jennings, who served as deputy political director in the George W. Bush administration and is now running a pro-McConnell super PAC in Kentucky. "The political instinct of when to do things is not something you teach—you either have it or you don't. He's got a knack for finding populist issues showing why the government is stupid, and people like it."

  9. #79
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    From The Washington Post:

    How Rand Paul is winning

    To hear Republicans who follow these sorts of things closely, there are actually two primaries for the 2016 Republican presidential nomination.

    The first is the fight to be the establishment conservative pick, a battle that could include Govs. Chris Christie (N.J), Bobby Jindal (La.), John Kasich (Ohio) and Scott Walker (Wisc.) as well as Sen. Marco Rubio (Fla.) and, possibly, former Gov. Jeb Bush (Fla.) and Rep. Paul Ryan (Wisc.). The other is to be the movement conservative choice, a tussle right now between Sens. Rand Paul (Ky.) and Ted Cruz (Texas).

    The theory is that a victor will emerge from each of these sub-primaries and those two winners will duke it out for the nomination. That's a similar dynamic to the one that was at work in the 2012 Republican nomination fight with Mitt Romney winning the establishment conservative slot and former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum ultimately emerging as the movement conservative pick.

    What's different this time around is that the establishment conservative field is packed with potential candidates while the movement conservative field is relatively sparse. Which brings us to Paul.

    At the moment, Paul's only serious competition to emerge as the movement conservative choice is Cruz. (Other candidates like Santorum, if he runs again, or Texas Gov. Rick Perry, will likely try to swim in those waters before it's all over but Cruz looks strongest at the moment.) Cruz has strengths -- particularly in Iowa -- but he also hasn't demonstrated the broad policy agenda or ability to expand beyond his hardest core supporters that Paul has shown. And, there are still lingering doubts in GOP circles about whether Cruz will even run -- although, it's worth noting, the idea that anyone within the Republican establishment has a good grasp on what Cruz is thinking is somewhat far-fetched.

    Simply put, Paul is more likely to emerge victorious from the movement conservative primary than any of the potential candidates seeking the establishment conservative banner. At the start of the year, we would have said Christie would have had a leg up in that establishment primary -- and hence an edge to be the nominee since the party's pick traditionally comes from the establishment wing. But Christie's struggles to get out from under the lane closures scandal that reaches high into his administration has reduced him to just another member of the pack. Walker and Kasich both have the potential to break out but first need to get by real reelection races this fall. Jeb Bush would quite clearly be the establishment frontrunner if he ran but no one has any idea if he wants to or will. Ditto Paul Ryan. And, while Jindal seems to be gaining a bit of steam, he remains second tier in this group.

    Add it all up and you get this: Rand Paul is, as of right now, the likeliest Republican nominee. Our rankings of the other nine people likely to wind up as the Republican standard-bearer are below. Agree? Disagree? The comments section awaits.

    10. Rick Perry: The Texas governor spent two days this week in Iowa. He said it was to campaign for Gov. Terry Branstad. Um, ok. In conversations with Republicans we trust, they are convinced Perry is planning to run again he believes that the mistakes he made in 2012 are entirely correctable. Our view? You never get a second chance to make a first impression in politics. (Previous ranking: 9)

    9. Jeb Bush: If he runs, the former Florida governor is the #1 ranked candidate on this list. But, aside from conversations with a handful of donors, we see almost no sign that Jeb is doing the sort of things one would do if he wanted to run in 2016. Now, Jeb being Jeb, he doesn't need to start putting together a campaign as soon as some of the lesser-known candidates in the field. But, everything we hear and read about him suggests that while he would like to be president, he has almost zero interest in the process of running for the job. Given that, we are dropping him down in our rankings. (Previous ranking: 5)

    8. Bobby Jindal: The Louisiana governor has had a nice run of late. His denouncement of President Obama's lack of a decision on the Keystone XL pipeline made national headlines and set him up as a foil to the current occupant of the White House -- a very good thing for an ambitious Republican. And, as National Review's Eliana Johnson documented, Jindal is hiring the sort of quality people that will form the foundation of a presidential campaign. Still, there's almost no buzz for Jindal in Republican circles at the moment. Might he be Tim Pawlenty 2.0? (Previous ranking: 6)

    7. John Kasich: It's worth reading the Ohio governor's state of the state address, which he delivered on Monday. It lays out a broad governing vision that, if he wins this fall, Kasich would be very well positioned to run on in 2016. His political team continues to be cagey about whether or not he would run but we tend to believe that candidates who have run unsuccessfully for president are much more likely than the average bear to run again. Keep an eye on Kasich. He has the potential to move up these rankings post-November. (Previous ranking: 8)

    6. Paul Ryan: Oh, Paul Ryan, what to do with you? Most Republicans we talk to suggest that Ryan is far more interested in one day being the Speaker of the House than he is running for president. And yet, one very well-connected Republican insists to us that Ryan is very much interested in the race and that many in GOP circles are operating on assumptions not actual information. Expect Ryan to make things clear about his future sooner rather than later if for no other reason than to allow Walker to run if he doesn't. (Walker and Ryan are very close and we are told Ryan will have the right of first refusal in the race.) (Previous ranking: N/A)

    5. Marco Rubio: The re-conservatification (not a word but you get the idea) of Rubio is under way. Rubio has blasted President Obama over art history majors and hammered Iowa Sen. Tom Harkin over Venezuela and Cuba. Rubio still has work to do to prove to conservatives that he is one of them after his role in passing comprehensive immigration reform in 2013 but he is the most naturally talented candidate -- with the possible exception of Christie -- on this list. And, talent matters. (Previous ranking: 7)

    4. Ted Cruz: Cruz's decision to force a vote to end a filibuster on a clean debt ceiling increase earlier this month tells you everything you need to know about where he sees his political future. HINT: It isn't in the Senate. In case you didn't get the message, Cruz will be making a stop in Iowa in March and two visits to New Hampshire in April. The questions for Cruz going forward: 1) Can he expand beyond his relatively narrow base to win over fiscal conservatives in places like New Hampshire? 2) Does the antipathy that the establishment holds toward Cruz come back to bite him in the butt? (Previous ranking: 4)

    3. Chris Christie: There's no question that Christie has taken a hit in the donor community because of Bridgegate. But, we continue to believe that if Christie can weather the next few months -- and with the ongoing investigations and more document dumps to come things will get worse before they get better -- he can recover and become a serious contender for the nomination. Why? First, he will have a record of winning two races in a blue state. Second, because his style is so unique and, theoretically, appealing to a Republican base that craves non-political sounding straight talk. (Previous ranking: 1)

    2. Scott Walker: Walker isn't as charismatic as Christie or as strong in an early state as Cruz. But, he is someone who can appeal to both sides of the Republican party (the establishment likes his ability to win in a blue state, conservatives like his fight against labor unions). Why isn't Walker number one then? Because a) he still has to win reelection against a well financed Democrat this fall and b) it's not quite clear what he would do if Ryan decided to run. (Previous ranking: 3)

    1. Rand Paul: Dismiss the Kentucky Senator as a fringe candidate at your peril. He starts with the activist and donor base his father, Ron, built during two presidential campaigns. Onto that he adds his own political skills and a Republican agenda that, of all the potential candidates this side of Jeb Bush, might have a real chance at expanding the party's coalition in 2016. (Previous ranking: 2)

  10. #80
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    From The Washington Post:

    How Rand Paul is winning

    To hear Republicans who follow these sorts of things closely, there are actually two primaries for the 2016 Republican presidential nomination.

    The first is the fight to be the establishment conservative pick, a battle that could include Govs. Chris Christie (N.J), Bobby Jindal (La.), John Kasich (Ohio) and Scott Walker (Wisc.) as well as Sen. Marco Rubio (Fla.) and, possibly, former Gov. Jeb Bush (Fla.) and Rep. Paul Ryan (Wisc.). The other is to be the movement conservative choice, a tussle right now between Sens. Rand Paul (Ky.) and Ted Cruz (Texas).

    The theory is that a victor will emerge from each of these sub-primaries and those two winners will duke it out for the nomination. That's a similar dynamic to the one that was at work in the 2012 Republican nomination fight with Mitt Romney winning the establishment conservative slot and former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum ultimately emerging as the movement conservative pick.

    What's different this time around is that the establishment conservative field is packed with potential candidates while the movement conservative field is relatively sparse. Which brings us to Paul.

    At the moment, Paul's only serious competition to emerge as the movement conservative choice is Cruz. (Other candidates like Santorum, if he runs again, or Texas Gov. Rick Perry, will likely try to swim in those waters before it's all over but Cruz looks strongest at the moment.) Cruz has strengths -- particularly in Iowa -- but he also hasn't demonstrated the broad policy agenda or ability to expand beyond his hardest core supporters that Paul has shown. And, there are still lingering doubts in GOP circles about whether Cruz will even run -- although, it's worth noting, the idea that anyone within the Republican establishment has a good grasp on what Cruz is thinking is somewhat far-fetched.

    Simply put, Paul is more likely to emerge victorious from the movement conservative primary than any of the potential candidates seeking the establishment conservative banner. At the start of the year, we would have said Christie would have had a leg up in that establishment primary -- and hence an edge to be the nominee since the party's pick traditionally comes from the establishment wing. But Christie's struggles to get out from under the lane closures scandal that reaches high into his administration has reduced him to just another member of the pack. Walker and Kasich both have the potential to break out but first need to get by real reelection races this fall. Jeb Bush would quite clearly be the establishment frontrunner if he ran but no one has any idea if he wants to or will. Ditto Paul Ryan. And, while Jindal seems to be gaining a bit of steam, he remains second tier in this group.

    Add it all up and you get this: Rand Paul is, as of right now, the likeliest Republican nominee. Our rankings of the other nine people likely to wind up as the Republican standard-bearer are below. Agree? Disagree? The comments section awaits.

    10. Rick Perry: The Texas governor spent two days this week in Iowa. He said it was to campaign for Gov. Terry Branstad. Um, ok. In conversations with Republicans we trust, they are convinced Perry is planning to run again he believes that the mistakes he made in 2012 are entirely correctable. Our view? You never get a second chance to make a first impression in politics. (Previous ranking: 9)

    9. Jeb Bush: If he runs, the former Florida governor is the #1 ranked candidate on this list. But, aside from conversations with a handful of donors, we see almost no sign that Jeb is doing the sort of things one would do if he wanted to run in 2016. Now, Jeb being Jeb, he doesn't need to start putting together a campaign as soon as some of the lesser-known candidates in the field. But, everything we hear and read about him suggests that while he would like to be president, he has almost zero interest in the process of running for the job. Given that, we are dropping him down in our rankings. (Previous ranking: 5)

    8. Bobby Jindal: The Louisiana governor has had a nice run of late. His denouncement of President Obama's lack of a decision on the Keystone XL pipeline made national headlines and set him up as a foil to the current occupant of the White House -- a very good thing for an ambitious Republican. And, as National Review's Eliana Johnson documented, Jindal is hiring the sort of quality people that will form the foundation of a presidential campaign. Still, there's almost no buzz for Jindal in Republican circles at the moment. Might he be Tim Pawlenty 2.0? (Previous ranking: 6)

    7. John Kasich: It's worth reading the Ohio governor's state of the state address, which he delivered on Monday. It lays out a broad governing vision that, if he wins this fall, Kasich would be very well positioned to run on in 2016. His political team continues to be cagey about whether or not he would run but we tend to believe that candidates who have run unsuccessfully for president are much more likely than the average bear to run again. Keep an eye on Kasich. He has the potential to move up these rankings post-November. (Previous ranking: 8)

    6. Paul Ryan: Oh, Paul Ryan, what to do with you? Most Republicans we talk to suggest that Ryan is far more interested in one day being the Speaker of the House than he is running for president. And yet, one very well-connected Republican insists to us that Ryan is very much interested in the race and that many in GOP circles are operating on assumptions not actual information. Expect Ryan to make things clear about his future sooner rather than later if for no other reason than to allow Walker to run if he doesn't. (Walker and Ryan are very close and we are told Ryan will have the right of first refusal in the race.) (Previous ranking: N/A)

    5. Marco Rubio: The re-conservatification (not a word but you get the idea) of Rubio is under way. Rubio has blasted President Obama over art history majors and hammered Iowa Sen. Tom Harkin over Venezuela and Cuba. Rubio still has work to do to prove to conservatives that he is one of them after his role in passing comprehensive immigration reform in 2013 but he is the most naturally talented candidate -- with the possible exception of Christie -- on this list. And, talent matters. (Previous ranking: 7)

    4. Ted Cruz: Cruz's decision to force a vote to end a filibuster on a clean debt ceiling increase earlier this month tells you everything you need to know about where he sees his political future. HINT: It isn't in the Senate. In case you didn't get the message, Cruz will be making a stop in Iowa in March and two visits to New Hampshire in April. The questions for Cruz going forward: 1) Can he expand beyond his relatively narrow base to win over fiscal conservatives in places like New Hampshire? 2) Does the antipathy that the establishment holds toward Cruz come back to bite him in the butt? (Previous ranking: 4)

    3. Chris Christie: There's no question that Christie has taken a hit in the donor community because of Bridgegate. But, we continue to believe that if Christie can weather the next few months -- and with the ongoing investigations and more document dumps to come things will get worse before they get better -- he can recover and become a serious contender for the nomination. Why? First, he will have a record of winning two races in a blue state. Second, because his style is so unique and, theoretically, appealing to a Republican base that craves non-political sounding straight talk. (Previous ranking: 1)

    2. Scott Walker: Walker isn't as charismatic as Christie or as strong in an early state as Cruz. But, he is someone who can appeal to both sides of the Republican party (the establishment likes his ability to win in a blue state, conservatives like his fight against labor unions). Why isn't Walker number one then? Because a) he still has to win reelection against a well financed Democrat this fall and b) it's not quite clear what he would do if Ryan decided to run. (Previous ranking: 3)

    1. Rand Paul: Dismiss the Kentucky Senator as a fringe candidate at your peril. He starts with the activist and donor base his father, Ron, built during two presidential campaigns. Onto that he adds his own political skills and a Republican agenda that, of all the potential candidates this side of Jeb Bush, might have a real chance at expanding the party's coalition in 2016. (Previous ranking: 2)

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