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  1. #1
    Senior Member entpersonal's Avatar
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    Default Abortion and Ethics

    Please select one and explain. A breakdown I constructed follows.

    1) Abortion is murder, yet I'm pro-choice

    2) Abortion isn't murder (only a fetus, etc.), and I'm pro-choice

    3) Abortion is murder, and I'm pro-life

    4) Abortion isn't murder (potential for life, etc.) , and I'm pro-life

    Two might be the liberal stance whereas three might be the traditional christian position on abortion. Thoughts?

    I'm curious to see if anyone selects options one or four and why.

  2. #2
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    My aunt is 1, and we had a conversation a month or so ago about this. Her line of reasoning is people will get abortions anyway (she cited history to back it up too), and it's significantly more dangerous in that regard (more citing). No amount of regulation will ever stop it, so she has to "grin and bare it", do her best to turn a blind eye to it, and put her energy elsewhere. Trying to fight it would do more harm than good.
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  3. #3
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    I have to go with 1), but I will explain why:

    Personally, I think it's unethical to end a life. However, in order for our current society to function, abortion should be legal. This is because people are going to get abortions regardless of whether it's legal or not, and illegal abortions tend to be dangerous. Most of these people are teenagers who made bad decisions and are just very afraid. Currently there is no 'out' for them once pregnancy occurs.

    If we can create a society where there is absolutely no stigma associated with children out of wedlock, and a good welfare and adoption system in place, then we can really start discussing pro-life and pro-choice.

    I feel the same way about death sentences.
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    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21% View Post
    I have to go with 1), but I will explain why:

    Personally, I think it's unethical to end a life. However, in order for our current society to function, abortion should be legal. This is because people are going to get abortions regardless of whether it's legal or not, and illegal abortions tend to be dangerous. Most of these people are teenagers who made bad decisions and are just very afraid. Currently there is no 'out' for them once pregnancy occurs.

    If we can create a society where there is absolutely no stigma associated with children out of wedlock, and a good welfare and adoption system in place, then we can really start discussing pro-life and pro-choice.

    I feel the same way about death sentences.
    This. Plus, mostly only poor women will bear the brunt of making abortion illegal. We have a pretty good idea why women have abortions. We can address these issues and reduce it by quite a lot. Making it illegal will not save the lives of unborn children as much as it will damage the lives and bodies of poor women.
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  5. #5
    untitled Chanaynay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entpersonal View Post
    Two might be the liberal stance whereas three might be the traditional christian position on abortion. Thoughts?
    Sounds about right.

    I'm 2 from this POV. Although, I don't think it's even a fetus - that would be really late to get an abortion wouldn't it? Most get it around the zygote/embryo stage, just a little cluster of cells. I think the term "pro-life" for that stance is propaganda itself really. You could potentially kill a mother by not allowing her to abort her pregnancy. And it's not like pro-choice means pro-death. We just want the availability of them for those who need them so they can get them safely instead of going somewhere shady. It's not like we wanna force people who believe they shouldn't abort their pregnancy to get an abortion.
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  6. #6
    Senior Member entpersonal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21% View Post
    This is because people are going to get abortions regardless of whether it's legal or not, and illegal abortions tend to be dangerous.
    That's kinda how I feel about drugs, but that's a whole different beast.

  7. #7
    Senior Member entpersonal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    My aunt is 1, and we had a conversation a month or so ago about this. Her line of reasoning is people will get abortions anyway (she cited history to back it up too), and it's significantly more dangerous in that regard (more citing). No amount of regulation will ever stop it, so she has to "grin and bare it", do her best to turn a blind eye to it, and put her energy elsewhere. Trying to fight it would do more harm than good.
    I never understood how the same pro-life republicans could be pro-death when it comes to youngsters and war.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    This seems like a volatile thread just waiting for an argument to wreak havoc, I'm in.
    I'm a Libertarian by the way.

    Number 2 for me. To murder or take someone's life the victim must already have experience in life and be conscious, neither of which a fetus has/is. Probably doing them a favor in today's world anyhow (not really though because they'll just reintegrate http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...ad.php?t=67292 advertising ftw)

  9. #9
    Senior Member entpersonal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chanaynay View Post
    And it's not like pro-choice means pro-death.
    Presupposing that pro-choice leads to a decision and also presupposing the fetus isn't a life, then that's correct. How are abortions legal when murder isn't legal and murdering a pregnant woman could earn you two counts?

  10. #10
    climb on Showbread's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entpersonal View Post
    Please select one and explain. A breakdown I constructed follows.

    1) Abortion is murder, yet I'm pro-choice
    This one. I do not support abortion, but I cannot see outlawing it being beneficial. I volunteer at a child abuse clinic and so many of the children there have parents that should not have become parents when they did.

    I think there needs to be a lot of work in the way of preventing abortions, starting with making contraceptives as available as possible.
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