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  1. #11
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Tomorrow is MLK day. In a nice coincidence, I was just reading this excerpt from a letter to his future wife from 1952.

    "I imagine you already know that I am much more socialistic in my economic theory than capitalistic. And yet I am not so opposed to capitalism that I have failed to see its relative merits. It started out with a noble and high motive, to block the trade monopolies of nobles, but like most human systems it falls victim to the very thing it was revolting against. So today capitalism has outlived its usefulness. It has brought about a system that takes necessities from the masses to give luxuries to the classes." ~ Martin Luther King.

    I think Dr. King is pretty obviously a man who appeals to arguments founded on moral truths, both couched in religion and in humanism. A lot of socialists I know of are passionate and idealistic, perhaps to a fault. It's weird to me to think of socialism as any more amoral than any other socioeconomic ideology.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  2. #12
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    Lower standard of living.

    Nuff said.

  3. #13
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    One question that I love asking socialists is "Where are all the great socialists?" Sure, there are great men like Einstein and MLK who believe in socialism, but they aren't products of socialism. Einstein was great because of this theories in physics and MLK was great because of his civil rights work. I can name a thousand great men and women who shaped the world for the better and improved the state of humanity, because of capitalism. Socialism has no such record of success.

    I would urge everyone to read the Communist Manifesto. It's a classic unhealthy type 6, Ni-dom work. Way too much Ni and not enough Si and therefore impractical and unhinged from reality, the product of a crank.
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  4. #14
    Sheep pill, broster asynartetic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345 View Post
    First, I want to say that I am not against Socialism because it limits socio-economic freedom, thus detracting from personal empowerment and rendering it to "Caesar" - it does, but that's not the main point.

    Socialism is a political-economic system that is ambivalent or even indifferent toward human value systems. It is not immoral, as with communism and fascism, it is simply amoral. It creates a moral vacuum in society which is waiting to be filled with something else. And what that 'something else' is will depend on whatever extremist causes are lurking in the political background.

    The present values vacuum will be filled by Islam.

    While various special interest groups vie to fill the values vacuum in the US created by media networks and their political pawns in Washington D.C., these are not faith-based groups. LGBT, for example, is not faith-based. Animal rights activist groups and tree-hugging groups are not faith-based. They are emotion-based. And their emotions are not strong enough to lead them to those suicidal acts of rebellion which cause much havoc and grief around the world. The activities of these groups rend societies along political lines, but not really along social lines, because those lines were already drawn centuries ago via the Judeo-Christian ethos.

    I'll finish this later. Things are getting nuts around here anyway.
    What are your thoughts on Libertarian Socialism?

  5. #15
    Sheep pill, broster asynartetic's Avatar
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    I will never be able to bring myself to align myself with the so-called Libertarians and neo-Randians in the US, but I can understand why socialism or the thought of socialism in america might leave a bad taste in their mouths.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyedecker View Post
    What are your thoughts on Libertarian Socialism?
    It's just more unrealistic utopianism. The latter always expects people to be who they are not. People are not "utopianistic" by nature. But if you desire to change humans into something more along the lines of your "ideal" - whatever it happens to be - then change must come gradually, as with any form of evolution.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  7. #17
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyedecker View Post
    I will never be able to bring myself to align myself with the so-called Libertarians and neo-Randians in the US, but I can understand why socialism or the thought of socialism in america might leave a bad taste in their mouths.
    That's the closest I've ever come to having someone admit to the fact that there is an American culture, although this culture is slowly being dismantled from the inside.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #18
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellenbach View Post
    One question that I love asking socialists is "Where are all the great socialists?" Sure, there are great men like Einstein and MLK who believe in socialism, but they aren't products of socialism. Einstein was great because of this theories in physics and MLK was great because of his civil rights work. I can name a thousand great men and women who shaped the world for the better and improved the state of humanity, because of capitalism. Socialism has no such record of success.

    I would urge everyone to read the Communist Manifesto. It's a classic unhealthy type 6, Ni-dom work. Way too much Ni and not enough Si and therefore impractical and unhinged from reality, the product of a crank.
    Are you saying that Socialism hasn't produced any great Socialists?
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  9. #19
    deplorable basketcase Tellenbach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal12345
    Are you saying that Socialism hasn't produced any great Socialists?
    Do you know of any great socialists? Socialism is a failed ideology whose relevance is maintained by a bunch of Ni-dom cranks and crackpots at schools/universities and newspapers. It's about time people started treating this nonsense for what it is.
    Senator Rand Paul is alive because of modern medicine and because his attacker punches like a girl.

  10. #20
    The Dark Lord The Wailing Specter's Avatar
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    i don't feel it works well
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