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  1. #31
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Maybe I wouldnt care so much about people trying to shut down equal opportunity if they'd not shut down every other sort of equality already.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Maybe I wouldnt care so much about people trying to shut down equal opportunity if they'd not shut down every other sort of equality already.
    It's not shutting down equal opportunity.

    It's keeping people who don't have the ability to finish college from wasting money (they can't afford to lose) on it.

    An opportunity is only present if one has the natural talents to take advantage of it.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    It's not shutting down equal opportunity.

    It's keeping people who don't have the ability to finish college from wasting money (they can't afford to lose) on it.

    An opportunity is only present if one has the natural talents to take advantage of it.
    You're conflating money and talent but then I can guess why from what you've posted already in this thread and others, particularly to Disco Biscuit.

    I've got a diploma, a degree and a masters from different universities and I went to a school which provided zero encouragement for anyone to do so, in fact they were amazed and others have been likewise since, considering it quite anomalous, at the first time I studied the tuition fees were paid, generous grants were available and if I'd wanted I could have claimed housing benefits but I didnt because I lived at home, my point is that there was no reason at all for anyone not to study under those financial circumstances, I was the first in my own family to do so, I hate the idea that others wont have that opportunity because of money.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    You're conflating money and talent but then I can guess why from what you've posted already in this thread and others, particularly to Disco Biscuit.

    I've got a diploma, a degree and a masters from different universities and I went to a school which provided zero encouragement for anyone to do so, in fact they were amazed and others have been likewise since, considering it quite anomalous, at the first time I studied the tuition fees were paid, generous grants were available and if I'd wanted I could have claimed housing benefits but I didnt because I lived at home, my point is that there was no reason at all for anyone not to study under those financial circumstances, I was the first in my own family to do so, I hate the idea that others wont have that opportunity because of money.
    You had the talent to go.

    The different track is for those who don't.

    I thought that was fairly clear.

  5. #35
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    You could re-finance your colleges.

    I got five years of university education for less than 13,000 € ($ 17,134) in debts.

  6. #36
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    You had the talent to go.

    The different track is for those who don't.

    I thought that was fairly clear.
    Its more about money than talent, the idea of a meritocracy is on the wane anyway in the declining west but there's still some need to try and correlate the welathy legacies and education or learning so the system is being reasonably rigged to try and deliver that.

    I dont think its really scoopy any of the talented poor out there.

  7. #37
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    If you're really talented, you might get to get paid to go to College like me.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    If you're really talented, you might get to get paid to go to College like me.

  9. #39
    Level 8 Propaganda Bot SpankyMcFly's Avatar
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    Let us not forget that college is all fine and good if it were free, which of course it is not. When you look at it as an investment and the cost can easily hit 6 figures.

    It's a debt that you can't BK... (I think the law changed back in the mid 90s) I know, I still owe on my college from the early 90's!!! no joke. I'm a slacker INFP though and don't prioritize it. I've got 17 children to feed and stuff.
    "The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents... Some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new Dark Age. " - H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #40
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    I'm for more technical, apprentice-like training but not tracking. Some rearrangement of accreditation so that people could study both collge prep courses and vocational courses. Many people don't learn well in our educational system which is so standardized,
    Some children deal with home situations that distract from their learning. some people aren't challenged or encouraged enough. There a many ways an 8th grader might seem incapable of college that would be misleading. I don't like the idea that some people aren't "talented" enough to learn or be exposed to higher level subjects. I think increased vocational training and destigmatization of not attending college is good but not segregation into "here are the people who think and here are the people who do". So like I said before, more fluid. I think it would be good for a college bound engineer and a vocationally bound person to be in the same welding class, or a future chemist could take cosmetology with the hair dye mixing. Either way I think it's good for people not going to college to still have college prep classes (even in just one area where they do well. For instance they might not be on track level with math but be fine in college bound english). And it would be good for college bound kids to have actual practical experience. For instance there was a "health tech" course at my high school that I think was most filled with kids interested in being nurses but not many people who thought they might be doctors because there wasn't really room in college prep schedule. More real world exposure to professions would help students make better choices about whether they need to go to college or what exactly they want to do. Gap year would also help.

    I think we'll roundedness is important for college bound and vocation bound students

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