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  1. #51
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    "ObamaCare Medicaid Expansion is one of the biggest milestones in the health care bill. ObamaCare's Medicaid expansion expands Medicaid to our nations poorest in order cover nearly half of uninsured Americans. The law previously required states to cover their poorest or lose federal funding to Medicaid (federal funding covers 90-100% of the costs) until the supreme court ruling on ObamaCare."

    Yet another financial stranglehold, this time on the states. OBEY - OR ELSE!!!!!!!!!!

    Disgusting.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  2. #52
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    Whether the errors are avoidable or unavoidable, I'm talking about the financial burden created by these ridiculous million-dollar lawsuits.
    Can you imagine how careless they would be without the threat of lawsuits hanging over their heads? If someone dies, their livelihood is lost to their family. If someone is injured, their care must be paid for and they may not be able to return to work right away if ever. That kind of thing can reasonably cost a few million. I *think* but I can't say for certain, someone who knows better than I do would have to say, but in countries where everyone has healthcare regardless of their financial situation and where there is a stronger safety net in place for those who are bereaved or disabled, there is less of a need for damages in order to help the victims of these errors.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  3. #53
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    Can you imagine how careless they would be without the threat of lawsuits hanging over their heads? If someone dies, their livelihood is lost to their family. If someone is injured, their care must be paid for and they may not be able to return to work right away if ever. That kind of thing can reasonably cost a few million. I *think* but I can't say for certain, someone who knows better than I do would have to say, but in countries where everyone has healthcare regardless of their financial situation and where there is a stronger safety net in place for those who are bereaved or disabled, there is less of a need for damages in order to help the victims of these errors.
    We already have healthcare for those who do not have income. That's not what Obama's "affordable" health care is about. His plan provides insurance for those who are presently not covered by a medical insurance plan.

    How do I know there is healthcare for those who do not have income? Indigent healthcare exists in the US. Nobody can be turned away from an ER based on lack of income. Clinics provide indigent healthcare. Even a local dentist office recently devoted an entire month to providing indigent dental health care based on grants and not on some federally-coerced healthcare program.

    Obama: DO THIS, OR WE WILL TAKE YOUR FEDERAL PROGRAMS AWAY!
    Obama: DO THIS, OR YOU WILL BE PENALIZED!

    It's fucking disgusting.

    We don't need any fucking royalty in this country, the US is based upon opposing kings and queens handing down their decrees or else it's "off with your head!"
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  4. #54
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...rt-time-nation

    "Who Can Deny It? Obamacare Is Accelerating U.S. Towards A Part-Time Nation"

    What next? Is Obama going to FORCE companies to hire full-time workers? Where does it end?
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  5. #55
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    We already have healthcare for those who do not have income. That's not what Obama's "affordable" health care is about. His plan provides insurance for those who are presently not covered by a medical insurance plan.

    How do I know there is healthcare for those who do not have income? Indigent healthcare exists in the US. Nobody can be turned away from an ER based on lack of income. Clinics provide indigent healthcare. Even a local dentist office recently devoted an entire month to providing indigent dental health care based on grants and not on some federally-coerced healthcare program.

    Obama: DO THIS, OR WE WILL TAKE YOUR FEDERAL PROGRAMS AWAY!
    Obama: DO THIS, OR YOU WILL BE PENALIZED!

    It's fucking disgusting.

    We don't need any fucking royalty in this country, the US is based upon opposing kings and queens handing down their decrees or else it's "off with your head!"
    Do you have any experience with using these services in real life? I'm going to guess that you don't. When an indigent person goes to the ER with a health problem, they do enough care to make sure the person is not going to drop dead on their doorstep or otherwise get them sued, they give them opiates and they tell them to see their doctor for a follow up appointment. But I can see you are upset, so I will get off your lawn.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  6. #56
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    Do you have any experience with using these services in real life? I'm going to guess that you don't. When an indigent person goes to the ER with a health problem, they do enough care to make sure the person is not going to drop dead on their doorstep or otherwise get them sued, they give them opiates and they tell them to see their doctor for a follow up appointment. But I can see you are upset, so I will get off your lawn.
    Yes, I have experience with indigent healthcare. I got taken care of properly, went back in some time later to visit the financial department and tell them my situation. The bill was written off.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  7. #57
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    I'm not from there, but...

    http://www.schsa.org/pages/services/ihcp/
    Stanislaus County offers these programs to indigent residents who would otherwise have little or no means of access to or coverage for medical services:

    Medically Indigent Adult Program (MIA)

    You may be eligible for the program if you:
    • Are between the ages of 21-65
    • Are a verifiable resident of Stanislaus County
    Have no Medi-Cal or major health coverage
    • Are able to meet financial and other requirements for MIA eligibility
    • Are a non-disabled adult

    Primary Care Services are provided by the Health Services Agency (HSA) based physicians and Family Practice residents at HSA clinics. For inpatient services, the County has contracted with Doctor’s Medical Center of Modesto (DMC).
    Expanded Access Programs for Indigents (IDG)

    You may be eligible for the program if you:
    • Are a verifiable resident of Stanislaus County
    Have no Medi-Cal or major health coverage
    • Are able to meet financial and other requirements for MIA eligibility
    • A non-disabled adult
    • Are a Federally Qualified Alien (if non-U.S. citizen)
    (Sponsored non-citizens must provide Affidavits of Support (I-864 or I-134), as well as sponsor’s income and property information.

    Primary Care Services are provided by the Health Services Agency (HSA) based physicians and Family Practice residents at HSA clinics. For inpatient services, the County has contracted with Doctor’s Medical Center of Modesto (DMC).
    Disability Evaluation Determination (DED) Coverage

    You may be eligible for the program if you:
    • Are between the ages of 21-65
    • Are a verifiable resident of Stanislaus County
    Have no major health coverage
    • Are able to meet financial and other requirements for MIA eligibility
    • Are a Federally Qualified Alien (if non-U.S. citizen)
    (Sponsored non-citizens must provide Affidavits of Support (I-864 or I-134), as well as sponsor’s income and property information.)
    • Are physically unable to work for twelve (12) months or more
    • Have proof of application to Medi-Cal Disability and Social Security (SSA/SSI) Disability

    Primary Care Services are provided by the Health Services Agency (HSA) based physicians and Family Practice residents at HSA clinics. For inpatient services, the County has contracted with Doctor’s Medical Center of Modesto (DMC).
    Healthy Cubs Program (HCP)
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #58
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Hatter View Post
    I'm not sure if you have had a quick glance at this, but here's what Wiki says (emphasis mine):



    Edit:

    Note that premiums for pensions are also mandatory for all people of Switzerland, which take into account all the income you have (wages, savings, landed property and whatnot) and that the maximum amount of pensions you get is fixed as well as maybe 3 times more than the lowest amount. All of these are not private, but state-run insurances.
    This guy says:
    "Chris Conover, Contributor 3 days ago

    Switzerland manages to provide universal coverage on a platform that is far more oriented towards personal responsibility. Everyone is expected to have coverage so they don’t free ride on others. But they tolerate a far higher level of out-of-pocket spending than we do here (31% vs. 11%) making everyone far more sensitive to over-use and prices. They don’t try to hide the cost of coverage by forcing employers to pay for it (which in this country gives workers the foolish illusion that they themselves are not bearing the cost even though economists of all persuasions recognize that workers generally bear the full cost of their coverage in the form of lower compensation than they would otherwise receive). They don’t have separate programs for Medicaid and Medicare: they rely entirely on private health insurance. The subsidies they provide for those who cannot afford to fully pay for their own coverage are quite visible for all to see, thus can be rationally debated and adjusted up or down based on the will of the people etc. Switzerland is by no means perfect, for all the reasons Avik Roy has described in a series of posts here. But it is a substantial improvement over the Rube Goldberg contraption called Obamacare which is peppered with inefficiencies and inequities that we’ll be stuck with forever if we don’t uproot this kudzu plant before it takes root."
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapoth...t-time-nation/

    Kudzu plant:

    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  9. #59
    unscannable Tigerlily's Avatar
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    I say go for it if that's what you both want to do and can find a way to make it work. I was under the impression that the cost of living there was very high, but a few articles I've just read state that it's similar to the US. The thing is people will always complain no matter where you live. The majority of people are incapable of being satisfied, and paying taxes is inevitable unless you move to a remote village in a shitty country, and even those poor bastards likely have to give something up to live in a mud hut.

    Are you that far to the right that you don't want to help your fellow man? You know I've been a supporter of Universal Health Care from the get go because family and friends who live in the UK tell me it works fairly well over there. On the other hand I hear they have a big problem with lazy ass fuckers that don't want to work and are living off the government, so I can see where some people in the US who work their asses off might not want to pay for someones healthcare who's a lazy ass. And even though we aren't close to being as socialized as the UK, people here in the US still find a way to take money from tax payers. My best friends sister gets paid to go to college. She's a former crackhead that won't work because she has checks mailed to her regularly. No idea what happens when that runs out. I mean how long can that scam work? She's working her way towards a PHD, but can't/won't hold down a job, or take care of her own kids!

    So for the record, I do support National Health Care for people who are disabled and for those who work. It's just going to take time (years) to iron the kinks out.

  10. #60
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigerlily View Post
    I say go for it if that's what you both want to do and can find a way to make it work. I was under the impression that the cost of living there was very high, but a few articles I've just read state that it's similar to the US. The thing is people will always complain no matter where you live. The majority of people are incapable of being satisfied, and paying taxes is inevitable unless you move to a remote village in a shitty country, and even those poor bastards likely have to give something up to live in a mud hut.

    Are you that far to the right that you don't want to help your fellow man? You know I've been a supporter of Universal Health Care from the get go because family and friends who live in the UK tell me it works fairly well over there. On the other hand I hear they have a big problem with lazy ass fuckers that don't want to work and are living off the government, so I can see where some people in the US who work their asses off might not want to pay for someones healthcare who's a lazy ass. And even though we aren't close to being as socialized as the UK, people here in the US still find a way to take money from tax payers. My best friends sister gets paid to go to college. She's a former crackhead that won't work because she has checks mailed to her regularly. No idea what happens when that runs out. I mean how long can that scam work? She's working her way towards a PHD, but can't/won't hold down a job, or take care of her own kids!

    So for the record, I do support National Health Care for people who are disabled and for those who work. It's just going to take time (years) to iron the kinks out.
    Why does everything EEEEVILLL have to come from "right-wing extremists" and not just from people who think about these issues instead of following their FEEEELINGS? Why do you support a British system that only works "fairly well"? Why not support a system that works extremely well? And why not just look at the gubmint's track record when it comes to these programs, considering the fact that they are not only widely abused, they also become more and more expensive to maintain until they finally go bankrupt?

    And anyway, wife's complaint has nothing to do with right-wing this or left-wing that. She did vote for Obama twice, after all. Based on her study of our state's plan, she's afraid that her pre-existing health conditions and lifestyle will make her ineligible for state-run health insurance.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

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