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  1. #491
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    God, you're hard work. She wasn't asking to be rescued. She didn't allow herself to be raped. She *did* find her voice. And used it to explain the insidious effects of Rape Culture and sexism on women's behaviour and psychology. You reacted to her in the way others reacted to the woman who danced against groping. Dismissively. Pejoratively. Without understanding. Exclusively fixated on the situation's whats but insensitive to its wherefores. The kind of dismissive intolerance you adopt towards women's issues is exactly why women don't speak up more often. Why do you feel the need to prop up the patriarchy? What has it ever done for you? Oh, yeah. Right.

    Of course she should have reacted more quickly. Duh. And was likely confused about why she did not. What she was doing was trying to analyse her own acquiescence in a broader context. A context wherein women's bodies are routinely co-opted by others, from childhood on, as the ESP vividly illustrates. Feminine acquiescence and submission is the norm, drummed into girls from infancy. The pressure to conform to that norm erodes self-esteem. The sexism of the everyday erodes self-esteem, and that in turn undermines the capacity to assert one's own agency. What happens as a result demonstrates why it is an inherently unhealthy way of being in the world that needs to change. But even that knowledge doesn't automatically confer immunity on any woman subject to a lifetime of those influences. Situations are more complex than your black and white judgements allow.
    Glad she finally figured it out. Presumably she will know better next time. Even better if she will share her experiences with other women, so they don't have to learn the hard way. But wait: that's what she's doing in this article, showing women they have the right and the need to object and speak up. I am too, though, but you criticise me for it. No matter since I'm sure you don't need my encouragement, but I will continue to offer it to those who might benefit.

    Anyone who spends time in my company knows I feel no need "to prop up the patriarchy". Anyone who actually reads what I post on threads like this will be clear on that, too.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  2. #492
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    I read this thread from beginning to end, and then I went on the actual site. Do you know what struck me? It doesn't matter what race, sexual orientation, size, class or level of attractiveness you are, if you are female, you might well paint a target on your chest.
    Here's the really stupid thing, I thought it was just me and I was doing something fundementally wrong, or exuding some weird aura. I've been dealing with this shit since I was nine, when I had the misfortune of developing early. I'm a big fat ass and I still get it at 35. It was just week ago when some prick decided I must gagging for it, and said I'd be begging for his big fat cock before he was done.
    I don't even know where to begin.
    I'm not even particularly attractive.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
    Real life awaits and she is a demanding mistress.

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  3. #493
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    ^ if that isn't vindication for this thread idea and for the ESP I don't know what is.

  4. #494
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrystalViolet View Post
    I read this thread from beginning to end, and then I went on the actual site. Do you know what struck me? It doesn't matter what race, sexual orientation, size, class or level of attractiveness you are, if you are female, you might well paint a target on your chest.
    Here's the really stupid thing, I thought it was just me and I was doing something fundementally wrong, or exuding some weird aura. I've been dealing with this shit since I was nine, when I had the misfortune of developing early. I'm a big fat ass and I still get it at 35. It was just week ago when some prick decided I must gagging for it, and said I'd be begging for his big fat cock before he was done.
    I don't even know where to begin.
    I'm not even particularly attractive.
    The bolded is my experience as well. When women talk about this, it isnt about bragging how many guys have gawked at her and how attractive she is (and often you get told that it's a luxury problem to have too many guys interested in you and you need to shut up already by both men and women)...it's about being frustrated that you cannot get a moment's peace the second you leave your house. And sure, some of those encounters are incredibly flattering to your ego. But too much of that gets tiresome too...and its never just nice guys. Overall, it is comments of an entitled, degrading or meant-to-shock nature. And I have no idea what possesses men to make exactly *those* kind of comments. It's one thing to approach, it is another to pretty much ruin your own chances coz of the filth that leaves your mouth, not to mention waste my time and make me feel threatened in the process
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  5. #495
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrystalViolet View Post
    I read this thread from beginning to end, and then I went on the actual site. Do you know what struck me? It doesn't matter what race, sexual orientation, size, class or level of attractiveness you are, if you are female, you might well paint a target on your chest.
    Here's the really stupid thing, I thought it was just me and I was doing something fundementally wrong, or exuding some weird aura. I've been dealing with this shit since I was nine, when I had the misfortune of developing early. I'm a big fat ass and I still get it at 35. It was just week ago when some prick decided I must gagging for it, and said I'd be begging for his big fat cock before he was done.
    I don't even know where to begin.
    I'm not even particularly attractive.
    I'm still trying to figure out why my personal experience has been so different. I'm not particularly attractive, either, but as plenty of people have pointed out, that doesn't make much difference.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  6. #496
    Senior Member Bamboo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrystalViolet View Post
    It was just week ago when some prick decided I must gagging for it, and said I'd be begging for his big fat cock before he was done.
    I don't even know where to begin.
    Mind if I ask: before he was done with what? Talking with you? Leering at you on the street?

    I mean did he just walk up and say "i bet you want my big fat cock" or what precipitated this?
    Don't know how much it'll bend til it breaks.

  7. #497
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    I'm still trying to figure out why my personal experience has been so different. I'm not particularly attractive, either, but as plenty of people have pointed out, that doesn't make much difference.
    I find that it gets worse if you are noticeably chipper or happy and smiling while outside your house - not to suggest you aren't that way, but I remember that my INTJ female friend from school made it a point to glare at guys and outright ignore men and look like she was about to kill someone (aka, the intj death glare ). She did get harassed but not nearly as much as most of the other girls I went to college with. Incidentally, she *still* felt uneasy in a certain part of town where the local drunks tended to hang out, but couldnt avoid that place as that was where her bus stop was, so I offered to come with her and drop her off. From what I could see, the drunk men were a lot less likely to pick up on the fact that she wasn't sending the right - aka approachable - vibe.

    Meanwhile, while I got harassed a lot more overall, I also was better in getting out of that situation - probably due to that experience, and didn't have a problem being in that part of town.
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





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  8. #498
    Symbolic Herald Vasilisa's Avatar
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    Foz Meadows on The Creepiness Question:

    There’s a poisonous double standard in our society which says that it’s reverse-sexist and wrong for women to feel threatened by creepy-awkward male behaviour because our fear implies that we hold the negative, stereotypical view that All Men Are Predators, but that if we’re raped or sexually assaulted by any man with whom we’ve had prior social interaction – and particularly if he’s expressed some sexual or romantic interest in us during that time – it’s reasonable for observers to ask what precautions we took to prevent the assault from happening, or to suggest that we maybe led the guy on by not stating our feelings plainly. The result is a situation where women are punished if we reject, avoid or identify creepy men, and then told it’s our fault if we’re assaulted by someone we plainly ought to have rejected, avoided, identified.
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  9. #499
    The High Priestess Amargith's Avatar
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    Apparently we're just plain insane, V.
    ★ڿڰۣ✿ℒoѵℯ✿ڿڰۣ★





    "Harm none, do as ye will”

  10. #500
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amargith View Post
    I find that it gets worse if you are noticeably chipper or happy and smiling while outside your house - not to suggest you aren't that way, but I remember that my INTJ female friend from school made it a point to glare at guys and outright ignore men and look like she was about to kill someone (aka, the intj death glare ). She did get harassed but not nearly as much as most of the other girls I went to college with. Incidentally, she *still* felt uneasy in a certain part of town where the local drunks tended to hang out, but couldnt avoid that place as that was where her bus stop was, so I offered to come with her and drop her off. From what I could see, the drunk men were a lot less likely to pick up on the fact that she wasn't sending the right - aka approachable - vibe.
    I'm not usually "noticeably chipper or happy and smiling", but on the other hand, I don't make it a point to glare at people either. My usual demeanor in public is blank/neutral, and I am usually focused on internal thoughts. I ignore people individually while remaining generally aware of the situation: is anyone following me, is anyone moving too close to me, do I hear anything threatening (someone sounding angry or cursing, even if not at me). This is all just reflexive, though, and I suspect is much more type- than gender-based. Like many introverts, I value my personal space both figuratively and literally. I will be more deliberately aware if I am in a setting that seems unsafe, but my main concerns have always been getting robbed or mugged. I have honestly never been in a situation where I was concerned specifically about getting raped.

    I don't want to make any of this about me. I know I have been lucky, but can't attribute my positive experiences to luck alone. I started to wonder then, if there was something I do automatically that has spared me most of these troubles, can I figure out what it is and share it?
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

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