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  1. #1
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Default Make war on the unions. Again.

    In the UK at the moment the labour party is talking about campaign and party finance reform, I hate this question, I think that a lot of politicians make obscene money for performing their tasks in office, expenses scandals in which politicians have been found to be playing the stock or housing market and defrauding the tax payer make me think they should make less not more and campaign and party finance reform look to me like them just claiming even more money from the tax funds which could be spent on services.

    Anyway, the way that its been spun in the UK at the minute is as an attack on unions because, you know, everyone hates unions.

    Now I can understand people hating unions because they arent as good as they should be or because they're full of ideologues or people with grudges and chips on their shoulders. Although the hatred seems to be against unions per se.

    I just wonder if any other posters are beginning to wonder if attacking unions and working people has gotten old, I never thought that either were ever that mighty to begin with but they're a total and utter shadow of what they once were even at that.

    I even think that the attack upon unions and working people has been a kind of pollution which has ramped whatever alienation existed already associated with working, its no mistake that on the heels of all this its impossible to find good skilled tradesmen in the vacinity of London to change a lock, repair electrics or do emergency plumbing.

    I'm sure there's other factors like the increased access to universities did change peoples expectations for employment opportunities post-graduation but I dont think those are as pivotal as the fact working hard, even if you're not earning a lot, isnt something a lot of people are proud of anymore.

  2. #2
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
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    Default

    I don't know what union relations are like in the UK, but I do have a pretty good idea what they're like here in the US. I have no inherent problem with unions (well, except for public unions). If a company won't provide its employees with good working conditions or pay, I see no reason why people shouldn't go to an outside source to obtain that. But via NLRB regulation, etc, unions have more power in some ways than they should, (less in others) They're told what they can and can't do, certain industries are required to be unionized, etc. Unions are a function of free markets, but that's hardly how they exist in the US today. Workers should be free to strike, and even to use whatever legal means necessary to harm a company that won't deal with them, but at the same time, if that company chooses to bring in non-union workers, there should be nothing stopping them from doing that, either. The way unionization is regulated in the US is all screwed up.

    Here's an interesting article that talks about the issues with unions it if you're interested (written from a free market but left-wing perspective, in support of deregulation of unions and unionization)

    http://dissentingleftist.blogspot.co...roduction.html
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  3. #3
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I'm unsure what a "free market but left wing" perspective would be or could be presently I dont think its possible to hold that sort of opinion.

    Its a little like the choclate covered special K.

    The unions are about power and influence, working people organising that they might have power and influence, I know that they are only as good as the people who make them up and often there are careerists and communists infesting them but they are ultimately about the ability of workers to independently organise and that is why they are hated.

    Either because its an inconvenience or because good union work highlights bad management and managers and their kith and kin within business organisations hated that. In my experience, unless there's real politics involved and grudges, management will close ranks around other managers, even managers they know are poor and whose individual management style and ability is to blame for poor industrial relations.

    Although that's not really what the thread is about, this is all about proof that labour or whoever is contending for office is "one of us" as Thatcher used to say, I wonder when this is going to end and there's going to be proper rebalancing of politics away from bashing working people for the Nth time.

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