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View Poll Results: Should Snowden be freed?

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  • Yes

    34 80.95%
  • No

    8 19.05%
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  1. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by CapLawyer View Post
    What do you think?
    I think he should be given refuge in a foreign state and the US should just accept that he is beyond their reach.

    It could be the beginning of a process of recognition that the US hasnt and shouldnt have total reach, perhaps then there will not be these sorts of scandalous programmes in effect for anyone to blow the whistle on.

    The question which I know no one is going to ask, not anyone with a career in politics anyway, is how the US can or should be made accountable for illegally invading the privacy of foreign nationals, I dont mean foreign states but private citizens. This is wrong.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by LevelZeroHero View Post
    Common procedure when there is an international fugitive on board.

    Don't try to reason with them. In their minds apparently little lord snowden...or should I say little red riding hood...saved half of Europe from being watched carefully as they have debates on type forums and send email to their secret lovers.

  3. #43
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    No you aren't. Unless you have ties to jihad or nuclear activities, I doubt quite seriously that the us government will take the time to order a subpoena to Microsoft or apple to read your pm back log in your email from typology central.
    The problem is that the US Government does make mistakes, like any Government. It is very easy to link someone with terrorism, which may lead to rendition, torture and assassination. And all this under the cloak of secrecy.

  4. #44
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    No you aren't. Unless you have ties to jihad or nuclear activities, I doubt quite seriously that the us government will take the time to order a subpoena to Microsoft or apple to read your pm back log in your email from typology central.

    Sorry to disappoint.
    You got some readin' to do, Lucy.

    The documents also show that discretion as to who is actually targeted under the NSA's foreign surveillance powers lies directly with its own analysts, without recourse to courts or superiors – though a percentage of targeting decisions are reviewed by internal audit teams on a regular basis.


    And:

    Every year, the attorney general and the director of national intelligence spell out in a classified document how the government plans to gather intelligence on foreigners overseas.

    By law, the certification can be broad. The government isn't required to identify specific targets or places.

    A federal judge, in a secret order, approves the plan.

    With that, the government can issue "directives" to Internet companies to turn over information.



    It's not stupid how much you've chosen not to know. It's your government's gift to you..
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  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    The documents also show that discretion as to who is actually targeted under the NSA's foreign surveillance powers lies directly with its own analysts, without recourse to courts or superiors – though a percentage of targeting decisions are reviewed by internal audit teams on a regular basis.


    And:

    Every year, the attorney general and the director of national intelligence spell out in a classified document how the government plans to gather intelligence on foreigners overseas.

    By law, the certification can be broad. The government isn't required to identify specific targets or places.

    A federal judge, in a secret order, approves the plan.

    With that, the government can issue "directives" to Internet companies to turn over information.

    Yes, and for instance, Australian Telstra, our largest phone and computer company, has been providing information on its users for years to the USA.

  6. #46
    Junior Member NTzilla's Avatar
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    I believe he is both hero and traitor.

    Hero for revealing the truth about the NSA spying. Traitor for revealing the spying on other countries.

  7. #47
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    i think he deserves a nobel peace price for his actions. hopefully his actions will change the direction of US(followed by the rest of the world) in trying to develop a police state where everything is monitored by the government.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  8. #48
    Senior Member captain curmudgeon's Avatar
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    I'm not sure if there's a good answer to this question. What he revealed ought to have been revealed. It troubles me that there are people that don't think that the spying the government has been doing is no big deal. The problem is that there need to be guidelines in place to both limit powers that the government can exert in secrecy, as well as to ensure that certain information can be kept secret- we probably wouldn't want North Korea, Iran, terrorists, etc. to be freely able to access whatever information we have regarding them at any point of their choosing. My point is that there's got to be balance.
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  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairdoug View Post
    I'm not sure if there's a good answer to this question. What he revealed ought to have been revealed. It troubles me that there are people that don't think that the spying the government has been doing is no big deal. The problem is that there need to be guidelines in place to both limit powers that the government can exert in secrecy, as well as to ensure that certain information can be kept secret- we probably wouldn't want North Korea, Iran, terrorists, etc. to be freely able to access whatever information we have regarding them at any point of their choosing. My point is that there's got to be balance.
    Spy fiction is actually years ahead of reality on this front.

    The final Bourne novels, I dont mean the ones which have come after the movies or the others which correspond to the Bourne Legacy movie and after that but the earliest cold war ones which featured The Jackal as Bourne's nemesis, ended with Bourne becoming a kind of "regulator" of all the world's intelligence communities, targetting those which were crossing the line as he saw it.

    The latest ones from the author of Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy and the real classics of cold war paranoia actually looked upon America as more perfidious or threatening (to the UK at least) than the Russians.

    There's been lots of plot lines in popular TV shows, like 24, which featured all kinds of possibilities of a coup or power play taking place in Washington by old money and mercenaries backed by intelligence professionals of one sort or another.

  10. #50
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by highlander View Post
    He violated national security and broke the law. He violated his confidentiality agreements with the company he worked for. He caused his company to violate their client confidentiality agreement, at of all places, the NSA. He left his hot girlfriend in the lurch. He's not some heroic whistleblower. His actions demonstrate a lack of character and ethics. The dummy deserves everything he is going to get.
    It's good to know that you value government secrecy more than a well-informed public.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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