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  1. #161
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Cheer leader for plutonomy.

    Well I dont like the fact that the few can buy and sell me, seems worse than the voting away my rights idea and, you know, its actually happening as opposed to being a great big maybe.
    It's not a maybe. What do you think the US public's reaction to the "war on terror" is? If people aren't constrained by law, they'll overreact to anything. Sometimes they ignore the law, and it's insufficient. But it's better than nothing.
    You lose.

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  2. #162
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    It's not a maybe. What do you think the US public's reaction to the "war on terror" is? If people aren't constrained by law, they'll overreact to anything. Sometimes they ignore the law, and it's insufficient. But it's better than nothing.
    I dont disagree with the rule of law, it isnt perfect and I dont expect it to be so, UK law is made on the basis of reasonableness as a consequence.

    However, I object to the idea of plutonomy and the rich and capitalist running down of democracy. If I've heard the denegration that democracy is two wolves and a sheep discussing what to have to dinner I've heard it a million times, however I dont see why business practice cant be conceptualised in EXACTLY THE SAME WAY. The exercise of power in one context is considered wrong, in the other fine and I dont see any difference besides one does not reflect the goals of the ruling classes and one does.

  3. #163
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I am interested in why there is the problem though, the CEO says it is not a human right, does that mean he believes that its owners have a right to with hold and refuse to supply?

    I think that's where the accent is and why people have a problem with it, I think the reason why people think that has to do with more than simply what he is saying, its been proven to be the attitude of the classes towards the masses for a long time, the bail outs, the "dead peasants" policies at Walmart, the Citibank Plutonomy memos, there's a definite belief there and its being acted upon.

    There's a big measure of arrogance there, unmistakeably, its like the scoffing rich people in Gangs of New York who boast that they could pay one half of the poor to kill the other half, which was true and probably remains so, and there are probably other more clever business men out there who would proclaim it as a human right, that it was an absolute human right, that everyone should have it and supply should absolutely, definitely be secured post haste and right away. Then get tax revenues or some source of funding were there is a consumerism fail. That's business. However this isnt business, this is class struggle, which is what business' defenders dont realise is very, very bad for business and they should be challenging as much as the left wingers they flat out hate.

  4. #164
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I think that's where the accent is and why people have a problem with it, I think the reason why people think that has to do with more than simply what he is saying, its been proven to be the attitude of the classes towards the masses for a long time, the bail outs, the "dead peasants" policies at Walmart, the Citibank Plutonomy memos, there's a definite belief there and its being acted upon.

    There's a big measure of arrogance there, unmistakeably, its like the scoffing rich people in Gangs of New York who boast that they could pay one half of the poor to kill the other half, which was true and probably remains so, and there are probably other more clever business men out there who would proclaim it as a human right, that it was an absolute human right, that everyone should have it and supply should absolutely, definitely be secured post haste and right away. Then get tax revenues or some source of funding were there is a consumerism fail. That's business. However this isnt business, this is class struggle, which is what business' defenders dont realise is very, very bad for business and they should be challenging as much as the left wingers they flat out hate.
    Valid points. I guess you could say he's speaking from a bit of an ivory tower. And no doubt that would certainly complicate matters if say, there was a single source of water in a community and one person claimed ownership of it and denied it to everybody else. Maybe there's more history here than I'm aware of. Honestly, I don't know much about Nestle or their politics and my knowledge of the company is pretty much limited to them being a large food conglomerate whose products I see all over the place.
    You lose.

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  5. #165
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Still failing to understand what your point is or what you're trying to convey.

    You could say that there has been a confusion between needs and rights but you could say that for any one of the things deemed to be human rights.
    Such as?
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  6. #166
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I am interested in why there is the problem though, the CEO says it is not a human right, does that mean he believes that its owners have a right to with hold and refuse to supply?

    I think that's where the accent is and why people have a problem with it, I think the reason why people think that has to do with more than simply what he is saying, its been proven to be the attitude of the classes towards the masses for a long time, the bail outs, the "dead peasants" policies at Walmart, the Citibank Plutonomy memos, there's a definite belief there and its being acted upon.

    There's a big measure of arrogance there, unmistakeably, its like the scoffing rich people in Gangs of New York who boast that they could pay one half of the poor to kill the other half, which was true and probably remains so, and there are probably other more clever business men out there who would proclaim it as a human right, that it was an absolute human right, that everyone should have it and supply should absolutely, definitely be secured post haste and right away. Then get tax revenues or some source of funding were there is a consumerism fail. That's business. However this isnt business, this is class struggle, which is what business' defenders dont realise is very, very bad for business and they should be challenging as much as the left wingers they flat out hate.
    Must everything be about class struggle? Only if you want it to be.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  7. #167
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    Valid points. I guess you could say he's speaking from a bit of an ivory tower. And no doubt that would certainly complicate matters if say, there was a single source of water in a community and one person claimed ownership of it and denied it to everybody else. Maybe there's more history here than I'm aware of. Honestly, I don't know much about Nestle or their politics and my knowledge of the company is pretty much limited to them being a large food conglomerate whose products I see all over the place.
    Me too and for me that doesnt mean they deserve to be attacked or defended but a lot of political partisans make their minds up on that basis.

    Even looking at this as superficially as from a marketing and advertising stand point this is a massive blunder, even taking the all publicity and good publicity and controversary is free publicity, it seems like a very bad move.

    Although I do believe that this is indicative of a negative business or managerial culture of the kind which has become typical in the western world, its not clever but it doesnt need to be because it is totally unopposed from within or from without and its bound to be resulting in diminished performance and business failure, it will eventually have a consequences, possibly even consequences which its authors can not escape themselves but they are doing a lot to prepare for the failures they are causing and buying a way out.

  8. #168
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    Must everything be about class struggle? Only if you want it to be.
    Again I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say.

  9. #169
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Again I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say.
    I'm saying, think outside the box. Why are radical leftists so stuck inside their little world-view?
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  10. #170
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Still failing to understand what your point is or what you're trying to convey.

    You could say that there has been a confusion between needs and rights but you could say that for any one of the things deemed to be human rights.
    What things are deemed to be human rights?
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

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