User Tag List

First 41213141516 Last

Results 131 to 140 of 159

  1. #131
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Cafe and Jennifer: Minors can vote and they do indeed vote.
    Please stay on topic.

    We're discussing FL and the United States, and in the United States, the legal age is 18 -- unless you happen to be in a state that permits 17 year olds to vote in a primary as long as they turn 18 before the election.

    What governments do in other countries has no bearing on the case we are actually discussing in this thread. Your going on a scree about how the government is pandering to teens in some other countries is actually off topic.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #132
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,687

    Default


  3. #133
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    6
    Posts
    24,060

    Default

    I think what wildcat was saying is that the legal age of majority USED TO be 21, and was pulled back for voting (I'd add possibly for military purposes as well) and that he thinks (and to be quite honest I tend to agree with him) that it's actually a more reasonable age of adulthood, if not legally at least developmentally and philosophically, than 18.

    However- I don't think it follows that if you subtract the legal issues of majority/minority that sex between teenagers is always harmless and can never be predatory. There is a HUGE, huge difference developmentally between 13 and 19. I'm very firm in my belief that older teens have no business having sexual relationships with young teens.

  4. #134
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I think what wildcat was saying is that the legal age of majority USED TO be 21, and was pulled back for voting (I'd add possibly for military purposes as well) and that he thinks (and to be quite honest I tend to agree with him) that it's actually a more reasonable age of adulthood, if not legally at least developmentally and philosophically, than 18.
    Well, it was standardized in 1971 in the 26th amendment... which was a good 42 years ago, wasn't it? I'm still not sure why that has bearing on this discussion.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  5. #135
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    6
    Posts
    24,060

    Default

    Because if we're treating people as adults who are in actuality still developmentally children in some ways, then maybe the law is being misapplied. I think that's topical.

  6. #136
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    9w1
    Socionics
    INFj None
    Posts
    9,827

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    (FYI - the 12yo child in the front-screenshot is a registered sex offender )
    At the end of the video they say he was't convicted, so hopefully he didn't have to register.

    The good (or sometimes bad) thing about laws like this is that there has to be a trial (edit: unless you take a plea agreement). That allows for mitigating circumstances to be introduced and considered. I'd think the average person would understand that these kinds of laws were not meant to apply to a 12 year old texting a pic to another twelve year old. I do hope, though, that the kid was grounded from his phone for passing that pic along to his friends. By his parents, not the state.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  7. #137
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,687

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I think what wildcat was saying is that the legal age of majority USED TO be 21, and was pulled back for voting (I'd add possibly for military purposes as well) and that he thinks (and to be quite honest I tend to agree with him) that it's actually a more reasonable age of adulthood, if not legally at least developmentally and philosophically, than 18.

    However- I don't think it follows that if you subtract the legal issues of majority/minority that sex between teenagers is always harmless and can never be predatory. There is a HUGE, huge difference developmentally between 13 and 19. I'm very firm in my belief that older teens have no business having sexual relationships with young teens.
    Well, eve of destruction, the original song not the Public Enemy remix, had a line about "old enough to kill, but not for voting" which highlighted the fact that people were conscripted to 'Nam who were not able to vote on the matter.

    I agree too that the age of twenty one is more like it maturationally, its definitely the point at which consequential thinking begins to take root but even then more as a principle or precept than as a practice, a lot of people after the point of consequential thinking becoming a practical routinised response will be inclined to challenge less because they will more rapidly weigh up the likelihood of challenging behaviour being successful or resulting in escalations or prolonging of disputes. The old hippy idea about "trust no one over thirty" recognised that, although to be honest Abby Hoffman's idea that you "waste not even a brick" could arguably be a recognition of it too.

    There are of course learned responses which are practically the same sort of behaviour but the processing or thinking is different depending on the developmental stage and I think that's important.

    Maturational stages and crisis at the personal/individual and social levels I think are THE main stuff of life, often the unacknowledged underpinning of politics, philosophy etc. etc.

  8. #138
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,687

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    At the end of the video they say he was't convicted, so hopefully he didn't have to register.

    The good (or sometimes bad) thing about laws like this is that there has to be a trial (edit: unless you take a plea agreement). That allows for mitigating circumstances to be introduced and considered. I'd think the average person would understand that these kinds of laws were not meant to apply to a 12 year old texting a pic to another twelve year old. I do hope, though, that the kid was grounded from his phone for passing that pic along to his friends. By his parents, not the state.
    The US is not the same as the UK but I know in the UK that there does not necessarily have to be a conviction in order for there be a social services response which may involve an assessment of the situation and someones registration, the criminal-justice response is seperate but parallel and perhaps the police and the public prosecution service will actually advise those bringing the complaint not to proceed because it is unlikely they will secure a prosecution or they can not on the basis of the evidence etc.

    I know that may sound like a travesty but it happens, happens a lot. Its usually framed that in the interests of a survivor they should not be subject to any further ordeal.

    However, public protection responses, police and social services, remain options were chances of contact or further offending remain.

    This seems innocent and innoxious enough but what's being discussed in relation to that 12 old is pretty serious, there's a big deal in the UK about self-generated indecent images of children, these images being created by children themselves, circulated, which then can not be destroyed, which then reach adult or adolescent offenders which then make vulnerable young persons targets for predators, the arresting, ie stopping, and discouragement of that sort of behaviour is a big deal and children and adolescents who're encouraging it who are opinion formers among peers can be problematic.

  9. #139
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    6
    Posts
    24,060

    Default

    I've definitely warned my daughter that texting her boobs would put her at risk of being prosecuted for trafficking child porn, and that it's really serious especially these days since five minutes after you send it to a boy he's probably uploaded it to 4chan and reddit and it's being passed around by adults. I really suspect she would never text her boobs anyway but I'm sure nobody really expects their kid will text their boobs.

    Edit: texting her boobs would also put her at the 100% risk of having her phone taken away along with pretty much every other luxury and freedom she has.

  10. #140
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    9w1
    Socionics
    INFj None
    Posts
    9,827

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    The US is not the same as the UK but I know in the UK that there does not necessarily have to be a conviction in order for there be a social services response which may involve an assessment of the situation and someones registration, the criminal-justice response is seperate but parallel and perhaps the police and the public prosecution service will actually advise those bringing the complaint not to proceed because it is unlikely they will secure a prosecution or they can not on the basis of the evidence etc.

    I know that may sound like a travesty but it happens, happens a lot. Its usually framed that in the interests of a survivor they should not be subject to any further ordeal.

    However, public protection responses, police and social services, remain options were chances of contact or further offending remain.

    This seems innocent and innoxious enough but what's being discussed in relation to that 12 old is pretty serious, there's a big deal in the UK about self-generated indecent images of children, these images being created by children themselves, circulated, which then can not be destroyed, which then reach adult or adolescent offenders which then make vulnerable young persons targets for predators, the arresting, ie stopping, and discouragement of that sort of behaviour is a big deal and children and adolescents who're encouraging it who are opinion formers among peers can be problematic.
    Having a separate way to handle the criminal and social service ends of things seems like it could have advantages and disadvantages.

    You're right about the image thing. I suppose educating kids on the possible consequences only really helps so much. They're kids: they don't listen. It's hard to know how to address the problem. The consequences are pretty far-reaching for a relatively innocent act. Of course, life is like that more often than not. Nothing fair about it.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 33
    Last Post: 02-16-2013, 11:56 PM
  2. [MBTItm] 21 year old dating 18 year old?
    By Bamboo in forum The SP Arthouse (ESFP, ISFP, ESTP, ISTP)
    Replies: 72
    Last Post: 08-05-2010, 07:49 PM
  3. [ENFJ] 18 year old ENFJ guy seeking INFP girl
    By Sad Lounge in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 11-04-2009, 05:09 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO