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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    ...And promptly be shot by another person with a gun. Unless you achieved being alone with them, of course. In which case you could have achieved the same results with a box cutter. Try again.

    In fact, in that case you'd probably be better off with a box cutter since guns aren't exactly inconspicuous.
    That is my argument in a nutshell. Everyone having guns will not stop the crime, there are too many ways around it.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    That is my argument in a nutshell. Everyone having guns will not stop the crime, there are too many ways around it.
    My bad. I guess I misinterpreted what you were trying to say.

    The question is, is it worth it? Guns or no, is a world where only the citizens with ill intent have weapons the kind of world we want? I can't stand the thought of that kind of world, and every time I hear of someone going to prison for defending themselves *cough*UK*cough*, I get so angry I can't stand it.
    ...

  3. #13
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    It would be a lot easier for gun owners to not be complacent about their weaponry.
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  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    My bad. I guess I misinterpreted what you were trying to say.

    The question is, is it worth it? Guns or no, is a world where only the citizens with ill intent have weapons the kind of world we want? I can't stand the thought of that kind of world, and every time I hear of someone going to prison for defending themselves *cough*UK*cough*, I get so angry I can't stand it.
    To be honest for me it's not that big an issue and I approach this whole situation with a large degree of indifference. I can answer but I suspect my response would be different had myself or a family member ever be in the position. I think it probably is worth it because in my understanding many people treat the possessions like an arms race. If someone else has a gun they get a gun to ensure their safety. Somebody else who already had a gun have now lost their advantage and if they no longer feel safe will invest in a bigger gun or another gun to maintain the tactical edge. It all ends in one giant mess.

    Besides, it isn't just criminals who have weapons anyway. You have kitchen knives, rolling pins, vases and telephones to use as blades and blunt objects don't you? Anything (and I mean anything) can be used as a weapon in the house. This way you can defend yourself if you are attacked without communities being permeated with paranoia.

    On a side note: your complaint seems to be the law's preference for the criminal over the victim. Why would everyone having weapons change the apparent legal position?

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    To be honest for me it's not that big an issue and I approach this whole situation with a large degree of indifference. I can answer but I suspect my response would be different had myself or a family member ever be in the position. I think it probably is worth it because in my understanding many people treat the possessions like an arms race. If someone else has a gun they get a gun to ensure their safety. Somebody else who already had a gun have now lost their advantage and if they no longer feel safe will invest in a bigger gun or another gun to maintain the tactical edge. It all ends in one giant mess.
    I honestly don't see it this way, so I won't be addressing that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    Besides, it isn't just criminals who have weapons anyway. You have kitchen knives, rolling pins, vases and telephones to use as blades and blunt objects don't you? Anything (and I mean anything) can be used as a weapon in the house. This way you can defend yourself if you are attacked without communities being permeated with paranoia.
    The problem is that criminals frequently are the only ones with weapons, when it truly matters, anyway. A kitchen knife makes a very poor weapon (the tang often isn't strong enough to stand up to any significant force), and there are similar issues with all improvised weapons. In addition, there are plenty of those absolutely brilliant "weapons-free zones" where anyone following the law is disarmed.

    Most importantly, paranoia doesn't even come into play here. I don't own a firearm, but the weapons I do carry are not carried because I expect to need to use them; they are carried just in case. You wouldn't call someone paranoid for wearing a seat-belt, would you? You take common sense precautions to keep yourself safe, that's all it is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    On a side note: your complaint seems to be the law's preference for the criminal over the victim. Why would everyone having weapons change the apparent legal position?
    Well... in order for everyone to have a weapon, most of the laws that I have issues with would need to be abolished. That's not really my complaint, anyway. I just believe that everyone has the right to defend their own life and the lives of those they care about in whatever way they see fit.
    ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    I just believe that everyone has the right to defend their own life and the lives of those they care about in whatever way they see fit.
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  7. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    So, lets take the libertarian standpoint on gun control. I don't care if you agree or disagree with gun control, with the advent of 3d printing and weapons, all citizens will have the ability to create a gun if they so choose.

    So lets assume every citizen has a gun and the government has relinquished federal gun control laws. How would society be different? Would private businesses be capable of protecting themselves against armed citizens?
    I dont see a dichotomy between private business and armed citizens, watch Gangs of New York, private business has always been able to rely upon one half of the poor to take payment to kill the other half of the poor.

    To be quite franks lets not take a libertarian standpoint on anything, gun control/ownership included, I want to put libertarianism on a slow boat some place.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJ Arendee View Post
    So, lets take the libertarian standpoint on gun control. I don't care if you agree or disagree with gun control, with the advent of 3d printing and weapons, all citizens will have the ability to create a gun if they so choose.

    So lets assume every citizen has a gun and the government has relinquished federal gun control laws. How would society be different? Would private businesses be capable of protecting themselves against armed citizens?

    Would there be mandatory licensing (education, testing, criminal background check) that one must complete in order to obtain a gun? Or can anyone just walk into a store and buy one?

  9. #19

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    Most debates about gun control miss the fact that guns are commodities too, there's gun owners who from perfectly capitalist motives may support certain sorts of gun controls, ie prohibitions on new production and distribution of weapons without prohibition of owning existing weapons, that's just a neat way to see the value of your stock of arms go up and up and up.

    I so of prefer the idea that replicators wouldnt just be used by a bunch of immature punk kids to create an arsenal of weapons but could actually provide people with their own personal means of production, one small step for man, one giant leap for socialist kind.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Most debates about gun control miss the fact that guns are commodities too, there's gun owners who from perfectly capitalist motives may support certain sorts of gun controls, ie prohibitions on new production and distribution of weapons without prohibition of owning existing weapons, that's just a neat way to see the value of your stock of arms go up and up and up.
    Yes, but most gun cotrol debates center around the value of human life, which is a bigger priority than property value.

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