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  1. #41
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    Still curious about what exactly "racial confusion" is.
    That's a question I had about the article (page 2). I believe it means Katie will grow up not knowing whether she's white or black.

    I've noticed that racial identity is very important to many black Americans. I found this very interesting article:
    http://www.racismreview.com/blog/201...-under-attack/
    "The social identity of individuals is linked to their racial and cultural identities which give them a sense of purpose in life. It is common knowledge that Italians, Greeks, Russians, Germans, French, Swedes, Finns, Norwegians, Spaniards, to name a few, have identifiable cultures that are linked to their social and racial identity and that this identity is embraced, welcomed, and accepted throughout the Western world." Etc.

    If racial identity is psychologically (and socially) important, then could racial confusion be psychologically damaging?
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  2. #42
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    We survive on generalizations. However, not all generalizations are equal. I dislike poor generalizations, like racism. Highly inaccurate, essentially unwarranted, and harmful in its effects, it is a poor generalization.

    Racism can go beyond just being any old generalization, too. Many people take it to be a categorical absolute, which is much more problematic.




    It's mostly better for our society, because people with "issues" like that will help us get over the racial paradigm. It is more problematic for her, but I still think it's positive, because it will allow her to see the world more clearly the most people and I suspect she will learn some very good lessons from the experience.

    I hope she becomes a sociologist some day.
    See my question above about the importance of racial identity.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    Some people just are able to have contrasting views in their minds.

    My favorite uncle told my mom he though her interracial marriage was wrong, but he was still best buds with my dad and was always mice to me. :Shrug:.

    I think sometimes people are just so used to saying certain things and identifying with certain causes that they keep saying them even after they've been exposed to things that cause them to think differently.
    Unfortunately, yes. Too often people don't think for themselves and simply adopt whatever view they've been given.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    That's a question I had about the article (page 2). I believe it means Katie will grow up not knowing whether she's white or black.

    I've noticed that racial identity is very important to many black Americans. I found this very interesting article:
    http://www.racismreview.com/blog/201...-under-attack/
    "The social identity of individuals is linked to their racial and cultural identities which give them a sense of purpose in life. It is common knowledge that Italians, Greeks, Russians, Germans, French, Swedes, Finns, Norwegians, Spaniards, to name a few, have identifiable cultures that are linked to their social and racial identity and that this identity is embraced, welcomed, and accepted throughout the Western world." Etc.

    If racial identity is psychologically (and socially) important, then could racial confusion be psychologically damaging?
    I see this issue as akin to gender roles. Some people feel the need to identify more strongly with such arbitrary factors, but it doesn't mean that individuals should be forced to. If Katie doesn't know what color her skin is, that's not her parents' fault. Hopefully, she finds more meaningful qualities to develop her identity on.

  4. #44
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moniker View Post
    Unfortunately, yes. Too often people don't think for themselves and simply adopt whatever view they've been given.



    I see this issue as akin to gender roles. Some people feel the need to identify more strongly with such arbitrary factors, but it doesn't mean that individuals should be forced to. If Katie doesn't know what color her skin is, that's not her parent's fault. Hopefully, she finds more meaningful qualities to develop her identity on.
    Hopefully. But self-identity is developed in childhood. Children aren't likely to think very hard about this issue because they're not aware of it. The primary question is always "what career or job are you going to have 15 years down the road." And the answer is likely to be "firefighter" or "model" or whatever their parents happen to be doing.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  5. #45
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    This is news?

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    It is racist because it is stereotypes. The sad part is, if the scenario was a little black boy and a white woman no one would think twice, and then they'd assume she's a saint for adopting the kid. Black dude becomes a dad to a white girl needing a home and everyone flips shit. It's racist. The intentions for the girl to be safe is a thinking fallacy.. "She's with a black man, of a different race.. she MIGHT be in trouble." The girl's safety is NOT the primary motivation for the thought, even if it is what motivates them to come out of their racist shells regardless of racism being frowned upon.
    Definitely it's racist, although Baltimore's a weird city. The article only identifies an "affluent" suburb, and there's a heavy black inner city population down here. I think I've made mention before of my black friend dressed better than me being shunned at the Nordstrom's shoe department down in Columbia while the black clerks were chasing after me even though I was avoiding eye contact and wasn't interested in buying anything.

    IOW, it's not just that people are black, it's also factored with fear of lower-income, higher-crime area blacks -- Baltimore's got some pretty crime-infested areas, populated by black people, and that image I think resonates. When that white transgirl got the shit stomped out of her in McDonald's last year, it was by two black girls in a lower-income part of town. I think that fear is pervasive. If people can't tell the difference, they start making assumptions or feeling uneasy. And it's not just white people being afraid of black people, I sometimes have felt uneasy because I've seen people look at me (depending on where I go) when I'm the only white girl in the place and I would get the vibe that they didn't want me there.

    I wonder what suburb they are in.And while I'm all for integration, I'm wondering whether black folks will be hard on Katie because she'll be the "white intruder" when she's older. But it might not be the case, as right now they're saying she is being shunned by white peers and plays with the black girls. And she will no doubt pick up behaviors and dialect more from that subculture, so she might actually fit in just fine despite the color of her skin.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #47
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Definitely it's racist, although Baltimore's a weird city. The article only identifies an "affluent" suburb, and there's a heavy black inner city population down here. I think I've made mention before of my black friend dressed better than me being shunned at the Nordstrom's shoe department down in Columbia while the black clerks were chasing after me even though I was avoiding eye contact and wasn't interested in buying anything.

    IOW, it's not just that people are black, it's also factored with fear of lower-income, higher-crime area blacks -- Baltimore's got some pretty crime-infested areas, populated by black people, and that image I think resonates. When that white transgirl got the shit stomped out of her in McDonald's last year, it was by two black girls in a lower-income part of town. I think that fear is pervasive. If people can't tell the difference, they start making assumptions or feel uneasy.

    I wonder what suburb they are in.
    That's not racism, that's prejudice, as I argued above.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #48
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    This is news?
    No, it's anthropology.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    That's not racism, that's prejudice, as I argued above.
    Always one to argue pointless distinctions, aren't you? I write a few paragraphs and that's all you've got. Fine, see ya.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #50
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mal+ View Post
    That's a question I had about the article (page 2). I believe it means Katie will grow up not knowing whether she's white or black.

    I've noticed that racial identity is very important to many black Americans. I found this very interesting article:
    http://www.racismreview.com/blog/201...-under-attack/
    "The social identity of individuals is linked to their racial and cultural identities which give them a sense of purpose in life. It is common knowledge that Italians, Greeks, Russians, Germans, French, Swedes, Finns, Norwegians, Spaniards, to name a few, have identifiable cultures that are linked to their social and racial identity and that this identity is embraced, welcomed, and accepted throughout the Western world." Etc.

    If racial identity is psychologically (and socially) important, then could racial confusion be psychologically damaging?


    I think the is just another bad result of people conflating race and culture. I skimmed the article and it seems to be more about how Black people are affected by other's perception of their racial identity. That makes sense with the history of prejudice in the country that black people would be more aware of racial identity (as "the other") than white people who are seen as the norm. However I disagree that your race is what give you a sense of purpose. Since race and cultural are not actually linked (a greek raised by american will be have american culture) it doesn't really follow that Katie will be culturally confused. She doesn't have an innate sense of "white culture". (Again we're assuming white and black cultural are some how significantly different)


    I feel like it will be very easy for Katie see she's white and understand that being adopted means you aren't actually their biological child. I don't really see where that would be confusing.

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