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  1. #41
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    I've seen documentaries about the entire development of America being centered on Freemasonry. Much blood has been spilt in its preservation. The evil power it gives surely corrupts.

  2. #42
    Iron Maiden fidelia's Avatar
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    I think it would work better for you to give people something more objective to start from. This feels a little bit like that men should be mostly wiped out because they are useless discussion. It's just hard to take seriously. I have a hard time believing that all Freemasons are pedophiles and child molesters.

    I personally have some reservations about the origins of Freemasonry and feel some disquiet about the power they have wielded in the past. I'm not sure how much stuff to believe, as it's very hard to confirm/disprove many of the claims made. I've read from some more seemingly reliable sources (couldn't tell you where anymore - I think it was over 10 yeras ago that I read about it) that the rituals (and there is documented evidence of what those rituals consist of - many with their roots in ancient Babylonian/Egyptian religions) involve swearing rather violent oaths of what other members may do to you if you reveal any of the secrets of the organization. Certainly I've heard accounts of "accidents" that have happened to higher up members who have decided to renounce their associations with Freemasonry, but really don't have any firsthand knowledge to back it up, so couldn't say whether it's all conspiracy theory or if it's true.

    However, in general, a lot of the more serious rituals occur in the higher degrees of membership, rather than impacting your average businessman looking for a nice men's club to network in and do community work through. A couple of years ago we had a guy on the site that was a Freemason and we had a couple of interesting conversations about why he had decided to join and what they generally do at an average meeting.

    Anyway, I think it's a bit of a leap to assume that since JonBenet died a violent death and appeared to be sexually abused, that it was a predatory Freemason (perhaps in her family) who had done it.

  3. #43
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    My feeling is that it was a ritualistic sadistic ceremony gone awry. By someone they knew.
    Seriously? With the parents involved?

    Don't know about the DNA stuff. Maybe her mother planted DNA stuff from someone else...
    Yes, ritualistic sadism and mothers with no real knowledge of such things craftily planting DNA on her dead daughter's body is always a winner in a situation like this, compared to...uh... someone who might have seen their little girl decked out at a competition, grabbing and molesting and accidentally killing their daughter.

    Looks more like he had some pretty twisted ideas of what to do with her, and ended up accidentally strangling her.

    Who knows. We do know she was a victim of sexual abuse...
    We don't know that at all.

    This page, one of the first I looked at, explains why one can't conclusively assume she was sexually abused -- it offers the evidence from both sides:
    http://jonbenetramsey.pbworks.com/w/...Sexual%20Abuse

    Once we realize that "abuse" is not a given in this scenario, there is really no reason to be further castigating the parents except for perhaps Mom Ramsey living vicariously through her daughter's participation in the pageants in the first place.
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  4. #44
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    It's very interesting to see that Jennifer, who is the defender of pedobear freemasons here, is also one of the most obstinate defender of the freemason agenda for "LGBT rights".

    Anyway, yes, theses freemasons child abuse exist, their existence is proven, the problem: the police and the justice is ruled by the freemasonry itself, which does no really help the cops who do well their job to act with justice based on that truth. We have to admit that.
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  5. #45
    Senior Member Tiltyred's Avatar
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    Ditey, are you sure you're a 9?

  6. #46
    reborn PeaceBaby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fidelia View Post
    Anyway, I think it's a bit of a leap to assume that since JonBenet died a violent death and appeared to be sexual abused, that it was a predatory Freemason (perhaps in her family) who had done it.
    Agreed. I think AGA is really thinking of her DID (Dissociative Identity Disorder) friend, trying to make some sense of that.

    Adding the tragic death of JonBenet to the discussion seemed more like a way to provoke some discussion, rather than engage it.

    "Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one."
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    other things become ugly.
    When people see some things as good,
    other things become bad."
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  7. #47
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    It's very interesting to see that Jennifer, who is the defender of pedobear freemasons here, is also one of the most obstinate defender of the freemason agenda for "LGBT rights".
    Pedobear is an Internet meme that became popular through the imageboard 4chan. As the name suggests ("pedo" being short for "pedophile")
    I don't see her defending pedophiles.

  8. #48
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    You've started with a conclusion and you're working backwards to find proof for it. That is not sound logic. Pointing out unsound logic is not the same thing as being defensive.

    I think freemasons are kind of creepy but I'm with @PeaceBaby- I have no data for what you're talking about. And frankly, neither do you.

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Nothing cited. Lack of searchable evidence does not mean that there is not a faction of freemasons who perpetuate this. Indeed, it would reinforce the fact that that group is set-up to get away with these sorts of crimes. I've read they use drugs and blackmail to keep things secret. And when your primary targets are small children, there are relatively simple ways to keep them quiet.
    So....

    You throw out a theory with nothing to back it up but personal intuition based on alleged Freemason rituals that have nothing to do with child abuse.

    Then, when people understandably ask "Why do you think this if you haven't found any evidence?" as any reasonable person would, you actually assert that lack of evidence is just as damning as evidence because everyone knows those no-good Freemasons cover stuff up.

    Do I have that right? Because I must be missing something. I hope.
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  10. #50
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    It's very interesting to see that Jennifer, who is the defender of pedobear freemasons here
    is also one of the most obstinate defender of the freemason agenda for "LGBT rights".
    Excuse me? I stated I Googled the Freemason abuse topic and found nothing about it in Snopes or any other place that discusses Urban Legends, which suggests at least it's not a known "fake story"; I also noted that there are a number of pages of Freemason abuse in the UK. That sounds like the OPPOSITE of what you're accusing me of. I also have no idea what a "freemason agenda of LGBT rights" is.

    Get your story straight next time instead of trying to stir up more needless trouble.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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