User Tag List

First 614151617 Last

Results 151 to 160 of 164

  1. #151
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,648

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Is that in jest?
    I think he believes it, he's not the first though.

  2. #152
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Socionics
    ILI Te
    Posts
    1,387

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    We shouldn't close the loopholes. The reason being is that the more money that entrepreneurs make, the more jobs they can create. You're not looking at the big picture.
    So wait, are you actually in favor of the rich paying lower taxes than everyone else? Personally, I just want it to be flat across the board (or better, replaced with a sales tax). The idea that the rich should pay a lower rate than everybody else is utterly absurd, and immoral. At least a progressive income tax has good intent behind it, even if it is unfair.
    You lose.

    _______

    RCOEI
    Melancholic-Choleric
    Respectful Leader

    Johari Window|Nohari Window

  3. #153
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,567

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    So wait, are you actually in favor of the rich paying lower taxes than everyone else? Personally, I just want it to be flat across the board (or better, replaced with a sales tax). The idea that the rich should pay a lower rate than everybody else is utterly absurd, and immoral. At least a progressive income tax has good intent behind it, even if it is unfair.
    The poor would pay a far higher percentage of their income in tax under a sales tax, since much more of their income is taken up buying things necessary for living. Wealthy or even upper middle class people spend a much smaller fraction of their income on essential consumer goods. I always liked the idea of getting rid of all taxes except a state income tax. The state would divide the revenues among the cities and townships, and in turn pay its state share to the federal government.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  4. #154
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,648

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    The poor would pay a far higher percentage of their income in tax under a sales tax, since much more of their income is taken up buying things necessary for living. Wealthy or even upper middle class people spend a much smaller fraction of their income on essential consumer goods. I always liked the idea of getting rid of all taxes except a state income tax. The state would divide the revenues among the cities and townships, and in turn pay its state share to the federal government.
    A sales tax would have an adverse effect on the circulation of money in the economy as it would deter spending, whether the rich or poor are more effected or not.

    The state tax thing is something I'm familiar with but it is only going to create competition between states to attract investment capital, a similar thing happens already on the global scale and entire IT empires are built on moving money quickly across borders to exploit welfare and tax regimes which then engage in the same competition and a "race to the bottom" of unsustainable proportions.

    Even if this were not the case there would already be a great disparity between states, the agrarian, the industrial, the commercial and so calle silicon valley states.

    I think this sort of thinking is a by product of confederate thinking, secessionary ideas and also ethical or moral arguments about taxation, not underpinned by economic thinking of the kind MP has outlined already about the amount of money which is circulating in the economy which have nothing to do with ideas about fairness which are more easily contended.

  5. #155
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ESTJ
    Enneagram
    9 so/sx
    Posts
    21,648

    Default

    I was thinking about this lately when I realised that the changes implemented by the present conservative regime, unelected and unelectable which made a pact with another unelected and unelectable group of politicians in the parliament to seize power, has resulted in my being in a 40% tax band.

    I think there's a question to be asked not just of the whether or not the rich are paying fair shares but are the less wealthy, such as myself, being asked to pay unfair amounts of taxes and also, something everyone can ask, is whether or not they are getting any return on their taxes.

    When I think of 40% income tax I dont think of the UK to be honest because I see so much and so often the prioritisation of tax cutting but I'm beginning to think that it is all newspeak for shifting the tax burden from the upper income groups to the lower income groups and working people rather than bankers or financiers. When I think of 40% income tax I think of nordic nations in which everyone benefits from it, there is prosperity created by there being more money in circulation in the economy and not the upper and lower losses which MP mentioned, and also that there are universal and good public services, not crumbling services being dispensed from crumbling facilities by top heavy services.

    Its really exercised my thinking because I can not hope to vote for either a left or right wing party in the UK to try and correct this unfair levels of taxation and spending policies which are in effect in the UK.

    The right have exploited a lot of populist causes, dislike of welfare claimants generally and especially during periods of low wages, frozen wages and unemployment or under employment, the left hasnt anything to say and seems to be over a barrel to the financier lobbies as much as the right, while they may have less of a personal stake because of their own wealth.

    The entire way the taxation and spending has operated in the UK has been to protect the wealthy during the recession which if they didnt create it they did little to prevent or mitigate it.

  6. #156
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    3h50
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    4,460

    Default

    Tax rates should be raised on the rich because it doesn't affect me right now, and by the time it did affect me, I'd be rich anyway, so what's a little more money?

  7. #157
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Socionics
    ILI Te
    Posts
    1,387

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    The poor would pay a far higher percentage of their income in tax under a sales tax, since much more of their income is taken up buying things necessary for living. Wealthy or even upper middle class people spend a much smaller fraction of their income on essential consumer goods. I always liked the idea of getting rid of all taxes except a state income tax. The state would divide the revenues among the cities and townships, and in turn pay its state share to the federal government.
    It's true the poor pay more of their income for necessities, but most sales tax plans also exempt necessities. I understand and appreciate the argument, but I'm not sure it would necessarily be a problem...
    You lose.

    _______

    RCOEI
    Melancholic-Choleric
    Respectful Leader

    Johari Window|Nohari Window

  8. #158
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,567

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    It's true the poor pay more of their income for necessities, but most sales tax plans also exempt necessities. I understand and appreciate the argument, but I'm not sure it would necessarily be a problem...
    It depends on how many exemptions you start creating, in an effort to make the system more fair. I prefer a tax system that is based on how much money I take in, rather than how much I pay out. In any case, sales tax has always seemed like double taxing my money. It was taxed when I earned it, and gets taxed again when I spend it. If sales tax were the only tax, this would no longer be true, but the other problems would remain.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  9. #159
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Socionics
    ILI Te
    Posts
    1,387

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    It depends on how many exemptions you start creating, in an effort to make the system more fair. I prefer a tax system that is based on how much money I take in, rather than how much I pay out. In any case, sales tax has always seemed like double taxing my money. It was taxed when I earned it, and gets taxed again when I spend it. If sales tax were the only tax, this would no longer be true, but the other problems would remain.
    The problem I have with income tax is that even people who choose not to participate in the system still pay into it. Sales tax is more direct. It also forces the government automatically to reign in spending during economic downturn.
    You lose.

    _______

    RCOEI
    Melancholic-Choleric
    Respectful Leader

    Johari Window|Nohari Window

  10. #160
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,567

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    The problem I have with income tax is that even people who choose not to participate in the system still pay into it. Sales tax is more direct. It also forces the government automatically to reign in spending during economic downturn.
    But income tax revenues decline in a downturn as well, since more people have their pay or hours cut, or lose their job altogether. Also, how does one "not participate in the system"?
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

Similar Threads

  1. Rate the functions per their comfort levels in time of stress
    By UnitOfPopulation in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 07-02-2013, 08:25 PM
  2. [E8] How do you deal with an aggressive 8 in the work place?
    By knight in forum Enneatypes
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 07-24-2012, 09:20 PM
  3. [Fe] Fe help stat: what do I wear to an academic reception in the evening, no dinner?
    By Usehername in forum The SJ Guardhouse (ESFJ, ISFJ, ESTJ, ISTJ)
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 06-09-2010, 10:12 PM
  4. GM, So do I own the equivalent of a Pontiac G5 in stock now, or what?
    By Brendan in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-10-2009, 08:43 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO