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  1. #11
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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    termination. yes.
    To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, be nothing.
    ~ Elbert Hubbard

    Music provides one of the clearest examples of a much deeper relation between mathematics and human experience.

  2. #12
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I dont actually agree with term limits, I think the limits should be set by the electorate.

    Even in the UK were no term limits of this exist the electorate, even with a good government and a bad alternative, have tendency to elect someone else after a sufficient period of time has elapsed.

    The present unelected "coalition" of liberals and conservatives only got the voted they did really as a consequence of people casting protest votes or "feeling like a change" etc.

    That's all despite some massively biased media coverage which should have made the labour party the only "alternative" extinct.

    To be honest I can see how term limits, particularly shorter ones, could be very easily abused. The inability of any administration to see their reforms through before another comes into office and reverses them or simply abolishes them, as happened in the UK, would prevent any positive reforms, of any sort, being possible. Its not a political conservative's dream of some sort of stasis either as it would create a lot of frustration with politics per se.


    The political elites could even like the idea, it may improve the prospects of the unelectable and they could start to put it to the electorate that its the ultimate in some kind of consensus based government by administration rotation.

    At which point you've more or less reached full blown "chinese democracy".
    It's better than having a president that claims "Everybody loves me! They ALL vote for me 100%!" Because their goons - whom they allegedly do not support yet secretly do - go around and chop people's heads off.

    We don't do monarchs and we don't do dictators. I don't think we've had trust in the government since forever ago, and term limits are a fail safe for when things go bad.

    Edit: and also they gerrymander districts to fix votes in a favorable way because our voting system sucks. Without a term limit, that could go on indefinitely, making votes more of a sham than they already are.

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  4. #14
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    If he had only one term would it be "yes", "we" or "can" ?
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  5. #15
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Everything from increased polarization, to corporate influence, to extremely disappointing bipartisan deals have been attributed to the eternal election cycle driving every incumbent to make decisions based on their next campaign. For all those who think this is a real and serious problem, the most direct solution would be to not allow anyone a second term. Maybe the president would have one 6 year term. Representatives would probably need more than 2 years to be practical.

    I do see some problems with this. While the campaign mentality has negative effects on behavior, it should at least in theory give politicians more incentive to act on the opinion or interests of the people, which is fundamentally what they're supposed to do in a democracy. It could possibly be worse to have politicians who see election and then feel free to do whatever they want upon election. The other thing is that for all our frustration with having the same old guys in the legislature for 30 years, there are advantages in having policy continuity. Constantly shifting over to new office holds might be dysfunctionally chaotic.

    What say you?
    Enforcing term limits wouldn't actually fix any of these problems. Corporations would still fund the campaigns of candidates who support their agendas, they would just be funding a revolving door of candidates rather than mostly the same group of people every election. That might be less efficient for corporations, but only marginally so. Buying government influence still gives you more bang for you buck than treating your workers well and innovating once your company reaches a certain size.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #16
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    It's better than having a president that claims "Everybody loves me! They ALL vote for me 100%!" Because their goons - whom they allegedly do not support yet secretly do - go around and chop people's heads off.

    We don't do monarchs and we don't do dictators. I don't think we've had trust in the government since forever ago, and term limits are a fail safe for when things go bad.

    Edit: and also they gerrymander districts to fix votes in a favorable way because our voting system sucks. Without a term limit, that could go on indefinitely, making votes more of a sham than they already are.
    I understand what they are meant to do but what you describe, the sorts of corruption which term limits aim to prevent, can attach to parties as much as personalities and term limits will not prevent that. I dont believe that its possible for term limits to do that unless there's some kind of move away from popular mandates to administration rotation which is closer to a kind of chinese democracy like I say.

  7. #17
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I understand what they are meant to do but what you describe, the sorts of corruption which term limits aim to prevent, can attach to parties as much as personalities and term limits will not prevent that. I dont believe that its possible for term limits to do that unless there's some kind of move away from popular mandates to administration rotation which is closer to a kind of chinese democracy like I say.
    Well they'd have to pick a new candidate each time which at least slows it down.

    Except the case is right now that we don't have term limits except for the president. Even the vice president can run as much as they want.

  8. #18
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    If I were to ever become a politician, I'd like one term.

    50 years.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    Well they'd have to pick a new candidate each time which at least slows it down.

    Except the case is right now that we don't have term limits except for the president. Even the vice president can run as much as they want.
    I'm not sure it contributes to the polarisation or political pardigm shifts that there's been in the US though.

    Either having a mitigating or causative effect.

  10. #20
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    interesting idea that brings relevance to a lot of interesting questions.

    here's one:
    what amount of power do you think the internal management of a party has over their Representative for the presidency once he takes office?

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