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  1. #301
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Ultrasound, ladies. Amniocentesis.
    Bellison uncorked a flood of horrible profanity, which, translated, meant, "This is extremely unusual."

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  2. #302
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sleuthiness View Post
    Victor, thoughts on Los Angeles Lakers owner Jerry Buss' imminent death
    thoughts on the importance of pertinence, sleuthiness?
    -----------------

    A man builds. A parasite asks 'Where is my share?'
    A man creates. A parasite says, 'What will the neighbors think?'
    A man invents. A parasite says, 'Watch out, or you might tread on the toes of God... '


    -----------------

  3. #303
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    Thanks!

    Women are more likely to have BPD or Histrionic and men more likely to be Antisocial or Narcissistic. They're all cluster B peresonality disorders. I have been diagnosed as Histrionic in the past and I think my more "empowered" male mirror may be a Narcissist (female narcissists are rarer, but typically have been more empowered to have a sense of entitlement that histrionic women don't have). It would also explain why they (narcissists) frustrate me on such an intimate and profound level, but in rare cases may even attract me.

    Sometimes women with BPD are batterers, though; Theresa Knorr is pretty much the ultimate example of this. I think if she were a man she would have been diagnosed with Antisocial Personality Disorder; she didn't care about people, systematically murdered her own daughters out of sexually jealousy, shot her first husband and got off on "self-defense"...but she's classified as BPD (like the worst case I've EVER heard of BPD, ever,in my life) because unlike the Antisocial Personality, she knew how to appear "normal" or adapt socially on the outside. Also, most of her rage was fueled over sexual jealousy, even in the case of shooting her first husband.

    I think a lot of it is socialization, just manipulating biological impetus to gross and exaggerated forms.
    From what I've read BPD and antisocial are difficult to discern sometimes, because they both wreak havoc in others and in the world. I'd have to google to remember the exact difference...

    Not sure what you mean about your last sentence.

    By far, the majority of disorders are created due to neglect/abandonment/abuse. Not biology.
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  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    From what I've read BPD and antisocial are difficult to discern sometimes, because they both wreak havoc in others and in the world. I'd have to google to remember the exact difference...

    Not sure what you mean about your last sentence.

    By far, the majority of disorders are created due to neglect/abandonment/abuse. Not biology.

    In the last sentence I'm talking about the difference between men and women; the fact that men and women are even diagnosed with different personality disorders is largely due to socialization in my opinion, not necessarily biology, and if there is any biology, it's teeny tiny and exaggerated by socialization.

    The apparent difference between BPD and ASPD is supposedly that people with ASPD have no empathy, they really don't care, where as the BPD sufferer feels a full range of emotion...but in very black and white terms, from the most adoring love to the ugliest hatred.

    The reason why Theresa Knorr puzzles me is because of the complete lack of empathy she had for the suffering of HER OWN DAUGHTERS...and the abuse was pretty gruesome; I tend to associated any cruelty of BPD sufferers with an almost impulsive kind of rage, a kind of act done in emotional fear and the hatred springing from that fear, where as Theresa Knorr to me seemed like a complete sadist. Read her case. I was a little stunned she was diagnosed as BPD...but they link her behavior to her mother's death, unstable family life, and that her primary motive in each killing appeared to be sexual jealousy, not any kind of gain, where as I guess the person with ASPD would be killing for some kind of gain: money, power, sexual pleasure (instead of sexual jealousy), etc. Very disturbed woman just WTFBBQ...and frankly, nothing about her childhood that I've read seemed that extreme, I mean yes her mother died, but my god, she was twelve or fourteen when it happened, not five. So either there's some profound abuse in her childhood I don't know about or ...I don't know.

    She baffles me. Almost as much as that children's writer, Hedda Nussbaum, who under the influence of an extremely abusive and poorly educated New York lawyer, allowed her adoptive daughter to die of a brain hemorrhage after her husband had beaten her. Still, actually, Hedda Nussbaum just strikes me more as a very extreme case of battered woman's syndrome (still most battered women will act to protect the children, and sometimes this becomes their motive to try to leave) ...Theresa Knorr was one of the ugliest cases I've ever read.

    I just thought of it because you implied that women with BPD aren't batterers; and it's true...many aren't. Many just scream and holler and verbally abuse people and create scenes where they threaten suicide and so forth; my ex is male and I'm about 110% certain he had BPD, but he also had some comparatively mild violent tendencies. He does not have ASPD.

    Narcissism and Histrionic disorder both are very concerned with appearance or at least how they look socially to others, and place most of their self-worth on what other people will think of them (though the narcissist does a better job of pretending he doesn't care, because of his lack of empathy) ...but the difference like I just said, is the lack of empathy. Histrionics and BPD sufferers still are capable of caring for others and mostly just "act out" of their own insecurity, pain, etc. This is also true of ASPD and Narcissism ...I mean acting out of insecurity and pain...but people with ASPD and Narcissism lack empathy, which makes them USUALLY more dangerous (but not always, some narcissists are garden-variety emotionally abusive assholes who don't actually place anyone else in danger and live OUTWARDLY normal and successful lives).

    And what's interesting to me is that ASPD and Narcissism occur more often in men, and Histrionic and BPD more often in women. This implies that women biologically are prone to higher levels of empathy, even when abused, neglected, or abandoned. Or are they just socialized to have it.

  5. #305
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Just to toss some food for thought in regarding the discussion about BPD and it's affects on how people can react (however off topic it may be): My grandfather on my mother's side was diagnosed with BPD and he was stir-fry fucking CRAZY.

    He honestly believed himself to be Jesus Christ, that the initials for his name, A.E.S, meant "Almighty and Everlasting Savior".

    My parents had him committed when he called my mother up one day and, with all the calm of a complete lunatic, gently told my mother that he was going to murder my older brother and raise him from the dead.

    Needless to say my father, an ex-Marine, did not take kindly to this and the police had to get involved to prevent a gunfight from breaking out.

    Bottom line: While Theresa Knorr's behavior is certainly shocking and horrifying, it's about inline with my experiences in just how bat shit BPD can make people.
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  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by tinker683 View Post
    Just to toss some food for thought in regarding the discussion about BPD and it's affects on how people can react (however off topic it may be): My grandfather on my mother's side was diagnosed with BPD and he was stir-fry fucking CRAZY.

    He honestly believed himself to be Jesus Christ, that the initials for his name, A.E.S, meant "Almighty and Everlasting Savior".

    My parents had him committed when he called my mother up one day and, with all the calm of a complete lunatic, gently told my mother that he was going to murder my older brother and raise him from the dead.

    Needless to say my father, an ex-Marine, did not take kindly to this and the police had to get involved to prevent a gunfight from breaking out.

    Bottom line: While Theresa Knorr's behavior is certainly shocking and horrifying, it's about inline with my experiences in just how bat shit BPD can make people.
    I guess it's because of the lack of stable sense of self that they can have these bizarre delusions in more extreme cases? I remember about a year into my relationship with my ex I thought that he might actually have multiple personalities. But they didn't have distinct names or voices, nothing that distinct, that would qualify him for multiple-personality disorder. I later came to understand the nature of BPD, how they don't become different people, but aren't always 100% clear on who they are.

    Histrionic has been officially taken off of my medical record, but I would say it was probably a correct diagnosis. I resisted it for a while, but I think the more I make progress, the more I admit to it because I'm moving away from it. Apparently you CAN grow out of personality disorders, they can become less severe in middle age, and disappear completely in some people with mild cases, but it requires wanting to get help and grow of course, and of course people with more severe cases of a personality disorder may be harder to treat.

    Histrionics, unlike people with BPD, have a stubborn idea of "this is who I am." Though they are easily affected by other people's opinions of them and seek praise and overreact to perceived slights, this is the extent of the lack of self, there isn't the deeper lack of core self that people with BPD have. BPD is really sad, but it's also very difficult to be around for obvious reasons.

    Apparently Histrionics and Narcissists are more high functioning socially, in general, where as people with BPD have a much harder time, and ASPD often leads to a life of opportunistic crime; however, I think sometimes in the upper classes or with very well-educated cases of ASPD, it leads to a life of white collar crime instead.

    Cluster B personality disorders are characterized by dramatic emotions and chaotic interpersonal relationships.

    Did your grandfather have a dramatic relationship with your grandmother?

  7. #307
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    Women don't care about looks as much as men do in general.

  8. #308
    Senior Member tinker683's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    Did your grandfather have a dramatic relationship with your grandmother?
    As far as I know, yes he did. I never met the man myself and I only met my grandmother a few times (she died when I was very young) but according to both of my parents my grandfather was...a character. Very charismatic, manipulative, always after get-rich-quick schemes...that sort of thing. My mother's description of my grandmother to me when I asked her about this some years ago was a women trying to keep her family together while dealing with this man's lunacy. How they met and got married is a story I don't know but one I'd like to know more about. I've never really delved too deeply with this stuff with my mother because it's very hard on her to talk about it, even today. My grandfather is like this ugly little secret that my mom and my two uncles (her brothers) don't ever talk about.

    I do remember my step-grandfather very well, the man my grandmother left my lunatic grandfather for. Very much the wizened ESTJ. I can see why he would appeal to her after her relationship with my grandfather.
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  9. #309
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    Quote Originally Posted by jixmixfix View Post
    Women don't care about looks as much as men do in general.
    Women do still care about looks, though.

    But even more so, I care about age. I don't want some baby boomer dude I can't relate to, I don't want to have sex with my father, and I am utterly disgusted by what I feel would be wasting my youth with some geezer. I also tend to be hostile toward men in their late twenties and thirties who prey on very young girls as a general rule. I mean it's fine if it's one girl and you guys happened to truly hit it off and had a real relationship; it's another thing entirely to be a sexually predatory ephebophile.

    Yes, I think old men are gross. No, I don't want to be with a man who is more than 20 pounds overweight. I can't be judgey of a little extra flesh, but I won't date someone completely out of shape; walking across the parking lot without complaining is a big check on my personal checklist.

    I've heard men are more visual and women are more auditory (therefore the female preoccupation with lead singers of rock bands) but that doesn't mean that women are actually charmed by money. We're not, and those that are...they just want your money.

    I prefer to just be honest about it. I'd rather work in adult entertainment than marry some guy I wasn't remotely attracted to for money. Fuck that, that's like selling your soul; and the only great pay off would be if he were to die soon and leave you all of it.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    Women do still care about looks, though.

    But even more so, I care about age. I don't want some baby boomer dude I can't relate to, I don't want to have sex with my father, and I am utterly disgusted by what I feel would be wasting my youth with some geezer. I also tend to be hostile toward men in their late twenties and thirties who prey on very young girls as a general rule. I mean it's fine if it's one girl and you guys happened to truly hit it off and had a real relationship; it's another thing entirely to be a sexually predatory ephebophile.

    Yes, I think old men are gross. No, I don't want to be with a man who is more than 20 pounds overweight. I can't be judgey of a little extra flesh, but I won't date someone completely out of shape; walking across the parking lot without complaining is a big check on my personal checklist.

    I've heard men are more visual and women are more auditory (therefore the female preoccupation with lead singers of rock bands) but that doesn't mean that women are actually charmed by money. We're not, and those that are...they just want your money.

    I prefer to just be honest about it. I'd rather work in adult entertainment than marry some guy I wasn't remotely attracted to for money. Fuck that, that's like selling your soul; and the only great pay off would be if he were to die soon and leave you all of it.
    Woman care about a guys confidence more than anything but you can't say they don't care about money they clearly do, and if it's not money directly it's a sense and feeling of security that they loathe for. Older guys have that and younger guys do not. So some guy with a lot of money still has a better chance with a hot girl. Biologically she knows that her offspring have a much chance of survival if she is with someone with power and wealth. Guys look for a woman who is more fertile and is able to carry and nurture her offspring to the best of her ability. Younger girls in general have a better chance of success during pregency so they are considered more attractive by men. It's funny how obsessed Americans are with age just shows how ignorant and conservative they are. Statistically older woman are proven to have much more miscarriages than younger women as well. I have a cousin from italy who is married to a man 10 years older than her and it's completely fine over there. At first I thought it was weird but then I began to understand it as I thought about the type of culture they were born and brought up in. I'm not talking about pedophilia here I'm talking about two consenting adults, and if you look at it from a biological perspective a younger woman and an older man seem to be a much better match.

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