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  1. #21
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Falcarius View Post
    America’s healthcare system is like one massive bureaucracy, unless the state smashes the mini-monopolies then America will never have affordable health care. The vulturous care and insurance providers drain the healthcare systems of market forces, needed to make healthcare affordable, by fixing prices and access to services.

    Health care in America is a cartel; the solution is not legislation but rather litigation.
    Pretty much true.

    My family has a barely used wheelchair that cost $35k new and we are having a hard time even giving it away to charity. Our healthcare system has created ridiculous inefficiencies.
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  2. #22
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Falcarius View Post
    America’s healthcare system is like one massive bureaucracy, unless the state smashes the mini-monopolies then America will never have affordable health care. The vulturous care and insurance providers drain the healthcare systems of market forces, needed to make healthcare affordable, by fixing prices and access to services.

    Health care in America is a cartel; the solution is not legislation but rather litigation.
    It's a much more massive bureaucracy in the UK, and the UK covers more of the costs for less of the government's revenue and as such lacks an impending fiscal cataclysm.
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  3. #23
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Perhaps it's the provider-driven model that's part of the problem? You know, providers having incentive to do more and more procedures? I have a family member who works as an administrator for disabled patients that aren't insured/can't afford disaster procedures, and he has told horror stories about, for instance, drug-seeking, long-term care facility escapees having had something like ten lumbar punctures done (which is not only ridiculous, but dangerous) because they keep showing up to the ER and the doctors are happy to do expensive procedures because they get paid more for them.
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  4. #24
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Perhaps it's the provider-driven model that's part of the problem? You know, providers having incentive to do more and more procedures? I have a family member who works as an administrator for disabled patients that aren't insured/can't afford disaster procedures, and he has told horror stories about, for instance, drug-seeking, long-term care facility escapees having had something like ten lumbar punctures done (which is not only ridiculous, but dangerous) because they keep showing up to the ER and the doctors are happy to do expensive procedures because they get paid more for them.
    Yeah, they are in on it, like I said earlier.

    Also even in some cases there are doctors that have a kind of narcissistic moral bent, such that if they believe one is a drug seeker, they will still run painful tests as a discouragement - kind of like "Ok. Run a spinal tap on them and see if they flinch."

  5. #25
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    A lot of it has to do with the cost of technological innovation in the industry.

    For instance, an MRI machine costs between $1 and $3 million dollars.

  6. #26
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    A lot of it has to do with the cost of technological innovation in the industry.

    For instance, an MRI machine costs between $1 and $3 million dollars.
    Yes, and about 26 million MRI's are done in a year to the tune of $500 to $3,000 a pop.

    We have somewhere around 10,000 MRI machines. (some places state we have about 8,000 but I'll use a more generous number)

    If hypothetically the number of MRI's are spread evenly to the number of machines, that's 2,600,000 per machine. If they charged a dollar they already paid for it, and paid for it twice on some machines.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    Yes, and about 26 million MRI's are done in a year to the tune of $500 to $3,000 a pop.

    We have somewhere around 10,000 MRI machines. (some places state we have about 8,000 but I'll use a more generous number)

    If hypothetically the number of MRI's are spread evenly to the number of machines, that's 2,600,000 per machine. If they charged a dollar they already paid for it, and paid for it twice on some machines.
    You might want to do that math again.

    And where did you get your numbers?

  8. #28
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    You might want to do that math again.
    Why? What's wrong?

    Yeah it's not possible to do 2 million MRI's on one machine in a year, but that isn't the point. They can fit in that 26 million because more than one machine is running at a time. So if they were doing an MRI per hour through a year, they could get 26 million done with about 3,000 machines which is less than half of the number we have.

    And where did you get your numbers?
    A bunch of different websites, I had to collect the numbers.

    Edit: I see what I did wrong. I don't know how I came up with that.

    It should be 2600 per machine, which would come out to 384. The zeroes always get me.

  9. #29
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    26 mill / 10k = 2,600

    And the number of tests is more reflective of the practice of defensive medicine than anything else.

  10. #30
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    26 mill / 10k = 2,600

    And the number of tests is more reflective of the practice of defensive medicine than anything else.
    Yes, that still doesn't explain the still exorbitant costs even at the correct ratio.

    The point being that they are not that expensive with the amount that they are used.

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