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  1. #41
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    If the way you express your support is by voting for women just because they're women, then yes, I think it does. It's patronizing. And if the author of that article had said that she supported Obama because of policies he espouses that aim to correct racial inequity in America, I wouldn't find that racist.
    Nope, I would be voting strictly on what the statistical data said about women as a demographic group. They are paid less for doing the same work, and I would therefore vote for politicians who would push through legislation to correct that. I want to know if pure mercury would consider me a sexist for doing so.

    Also, pure mercury, would I be a racist for supporting affirmative action policies?
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
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  2. #42
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    If the way you express your support is by voting for women just because they're women, then yes, I think it does. It's patronizing. And if the author of that article had said that she supported Obama because of policies he espouses that aim to correct racial inequity in America, I wouldn't find that racist.
    Yes - I might ask the question - would you vote for Conde Rice? Elizabeth Dole? simply because they're women?
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  3. #43
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Nope, I would be voting strictly on what the statistical data said about women as a demographic group. They are paid less for doing the same work, and I would therefore vote for politicians who would push through legislation to correct that. I want to know if pure mercury would consider me a sexist for doing so.

    Also, pure mercury, would I be a racist for supporting affirmative action policies?
    I'm not answering for pure_mercury but I think you're describing something very different from the article that he posted. I'm not even sure how these things came to be linked in your mind.
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  4. #44
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Nope, I would be voting strictly on what the statistical data said about women as a demographic group. They are paid less for doing the same work, and I would therefore vote for politicians who would push through legislation to correct that. I want to know if pure mercury would consider me a sexist for doing so.

    Also, pure mercury, would I be a racist for supporting affirmative action policies?
    Yeah, you shouldn't vote strictly on statistical data, since there are often enough outliers.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  5. #45
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    Yeah, you shouldn't vote strictly on statistical data, since there are often enough outliers.
    Eh?

    The glass ceiling does indeed confound the statistics. But assuming that I take all that into account.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
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  6. #46
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    There is a difference between racism and bigotry. Her reasoning is explicitly racist.
    Most people associate the word "racist" with the word "bigot," seeing them both as rooted in some type of xenophobic hatred and impulse to oppress. The evidence is right here in this thread. You can craft your definition of the word racist any way you want and I really have no problem, but you may want to be mindful of the associations others make. Or not.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Eh?

    The glass ceiling does indeed confound the statistics. But assuming that I take all that into account.
    By that, I meant that you should not vote for a woman because she's a woman and women statistically believe x, y, and z because they have a, b, and c experiences. That doesn't work out in reality. Not all women are feminists.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    By that, I meant that you should not vote for a woman because she's a woman and women statistically believe x, y, and z because they have a, b, and c experiences. That doesn't work out in reality. Not all women are feminists.
    I'm not talking about voting for a woman, I"m talking about voting for policies that would justify appropriate wages.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
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  9. #49
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    You know - I don't really have time to get into it right now, and I don't really have all my thoughts lined up anyway. But this is my gut reaction to the whole "voting for Obama because he's black is racist" statement: It seems to be a very different thing to vote FOR somebody because of the color of his skin than to vote AGAINST him because of the color of his skin.

    I mean, I don't think it's a good reason to vote FOR somebody, but I also am not totally sure that it should be called racism.
    It's an interesting distinction to make, but racism doesn't have to assign negative connotations, does it?

    Also, on the other hand, what about a black voter who voted for Obama because Hillary Clinton is white, as opposed to Obama being black? Would that be racist?
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  10. #50
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post
    Most people associate the word "racist" with the word "bigot," seeing them both as rooted in some type of xenophobic hatred and impulse to oppress. The evidence is right here in this thread. You can craft your definition of the word racist any way you want and I really have no problem, but you may want to be mindful of the associations others make. Or not.
    Most people equate "ignorance" with "stupidity" and "welfare state" with "socialism" and "income" with "wealth." That doesn't mean they're right. Racism does NOT necessarily equate with xenophobic hatred and impulse to oppress. That's my point.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

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