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  1. #501
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I can't believe even the National Review let that thing go to print. She managed to get almost everything in it wrong. Number one, the school was K-4, not K-5 so there were no "husky 12-year-old boys" there. Number two, there WAS a male janitor there who ran up and down the halls warning kids to get to a safe place. The story has been widely reported.
    Thank you for bringing that up. I thought I had recalled a male janitor but hadn't yet rechecked that one. It was just sloppy all around. Like I said, it really came off as just a platform in search of an event to launch it.

    I didn't even bother with evangelical writer Joel Rosenberg's blaming the massacre on Jon Stewart and what he represents in our country. *doh*
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #502
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    A lot of significant employment opportunities require a drug test.
    So don't take drugs before an interview.

    The police can't even look at your house unless they announce themselves and produce a warrant.
    So get a warrant!

    The other parts of the world stopped their guns because people placated to it. Australia did a buyback and got almost 700,000 guns out of it I think because people were willing to obey the law
    People obey the law out of a mixture of willingness and coercion. you think Australian gun owners owned guns because they didn't like owning guns?

    Not so here. Guns can't be seized from homes without breaking the Constitution
    Even if you were breaking the law and a Warrant was issued?

  3. #503
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Il Morto Che Parla View Post
    Even if you were breaking the law and a Warrant was issued?
    Of course. But that won't be any different than it is now.

    They can't just 'get a warrant'. They need a probable cause to do so. If most people are keeping their guns to themselves and not shooting anyone, as is the case already, they will not have probable cause to seize guns.

    They'll just catch the ones that they do catch while the rest are kind of floating around - illegal but uncaught.

  4. #504

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanton Moore View Post
    Can a mod please move the gun-nut portion of this thread to the gun-nut thread? thx.
    Sure, just as soon as we move all your posts to the "unproductive yammering" thread.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

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  5. #505
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    We have notions of right and wrong but the fact is that there are still by far more people who are not doing wrong.

    Mass killings are not normal. They aren't even usual.

    You can't call it normal until it stops being reported as significant.
    My point is rather that no one seems willing to assess guns as an institution. Discussion sticks within the frame the institution offers--guns are tools, one among many; they defend us from injustice and tyranny and burglars too--and has as yet not moved out to assess that institution for adequacy and appropriacy. But guns are a cultural institution for you guys, and as such, somewhere along the line, they influence other institutions. Concepts of right and wrong behaviour, good and bad action, appropriate feeling toward society and individuals... guns are part of those for you guys.

    And so, much like earthquakes in Japan, mass shootings in America are "normal". They're terrible and tragic and get a lot of coverage in the news, but these are things that "just happen".
    Bellison uncorked a flood of horrible profanity, which, translated, meant, "This is extremely unusual."

    Boy meets Grr

  6. #506
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    My point is rather that no one seems willing to assess guns as an institution. Discussion sticks within the frame the institution offers--guns are tools, one among many; they defend us from injustice and tyranny and burglars too--and has as yet not moved out to assess that institution for adequacy and appropriacy. But guns are a cultural institution for you guys, and as such, somewhere along the line, they influence other institutions. Concepts of right and wrong behaviour, good and bad action, appropriate feeling toward society and individuals... guns are part of those for you guys.
    Sure. We need to make some assessments. We're doing so.

    And so, much like earthquakes in Japan, mass shootings in America are "normal". They're terrible and tragic and get a lot of coverage in the news, but these are things that "just happen".
    I disagree. They are not normal. They get coverage because they are not normal.

    The things that "just happen" are the things that are not covered by the news. Just about every mass killing is covered in detail because they don't happen that much. The other crimes that take place get a fraction of coverage.

    I mean where I grew up, shooting WAS normal, you'd hear it every other night. None of it made the news. News crews would actually be in danger if they showed up there.

  7. #507
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    Of course. But that won't be any different than it is now.

    They can't just 'get a warrant'. They need a probable cause to do so. If most people are keeping their guns to themselves and not shooting anyone, as is the case already, they will not have probable cause to seize guns.

    They'll just catch the ones that they do catch while the rest are kind of floating around - illegal but uncaught.
    Yes, you need a "probable cause" in many countries - people have human rights in other countries as well you know.

    If nobody could use their guns ever without facing serious criminal charges, I guess there wouldn't be much point risking having them. That is the case in the UK.

    You can agree or disagree with the measure, but I do not believe it would be logistically difficult if the intention was there.

    Popularity is a different issue.

  8. #508
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Il Morto Che Parla View Post
    Yes, you need a "probable cause" in many countries - people have human rights in other countries as well you know.

    If nobody could use their guns ever without facing serious criminal charges, I guess there wouldn't be much point risking having them. That is the case in the UK.

    You can agree or disagree with the measure, but I do not believe it would be logistically difficult if the intention was there.

    Popularity is a different issue.
    The UK has guns though. In fact some nice pieces are made there.

    The UK didn't even go nearly as far as Australia did.

  9. #509
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    The UK has guns though. In fact some nice pieces are made there.

    The UK didn't even go nearly as far as Australia did.
    The UK makes guns, yes, it has a huge arms manufacturing industry, BAE Systems for example.

    Not many people own guns though. Even less use them. And not many schools get shot up as a result.

    It didn't go as far as Australia because gun ownership was never as popular.

  10. #510
    FRACTALICIOUS phobik's Avatar
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