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View Poll Results: Gay Marriage - Yes or no?

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  • Yes

    67 93.06%
  • No

    7 9.72%
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  1. #81
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Essentially, yes.
    Funny. Your own bisexuality blinds you to the otherness of the majority of others.

  2. #82
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    That is quite true: both do it because they have no control over it.
    Um. I meant cling in an unhealthy way. It would be more natural to be gay when one finds oneself in love with a person of the same gender. To cling means 'to hold fast to' or to be dependent upon. I think gay people cling to the description of being gay for many reasons, not the least of which is to give them meaning. But by the very notion they have to 'hold fast to it' implies that they might fall otherwise. Fall into what? Fall into the grey zone that means maybe they *could* have sexual feelings for the opposite sex that are hard to accept, for whatever reason. So being 100% gay, as hard as it used to be in our world, outweighs the intense exploration that would have to be done to fit into their hetero side. Swap this for heteros as well. I'm not discriminating against any group here. There is safety in labels. And this is my point.


    What does it matter whether it is nature or nurture?
    If it's nurture that implies there was likely some trauma or events that pushed one in that direction, and therefore it is more 'unnatural' for that person, then of course it matters.
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  3. #83
    null Jonny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Funny. Your own bisexuality blinds you to the otherness of the majority of others.
    Not to imply anything about AphroditeGoneAwry, but I'm reminded of those Republicans who were born into poverty and, through sharp minds, hard work, opportunity, and some luck, find themselves to be very successful (as commonly defined by U.S. society) in adulthood. They often mention their own success as evidence that those who don't succeed must be lazy or aren't trying hard enough. They miss the essential idea that not everyone is created equal, nor is everyone exposed to the same circumstances, even if by some broad metric they seem to be.

    If it's nurture that implies there was likely some trauma or events that pushed one in that direction, and therefore it is more 'unnatural' for that person.


    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    If it's nurture that implies there was likely some trauma or events that pushed one in that direction, and therefore it is more 'unnatural' for that person.
    Why must it be caused by a trauma or be considered unnatural? Would you say my knowledge of mathematics is unnatural?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  4. #84
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Funny. Your own bisexuality blinds you to the otherness of the majority of others.
    I do not identify as bi.

    I am simply 'sexual.' Or, actually, just loving.
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    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

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  5. #85
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Um. I meant cling in an unhealthy way. It would be more natural to be gay when one finds oneself in love with a person of the same gender. To cling means 'to hold fast to' or to be dependent upon. I think gay people cling to the description of being gay for many reasons, not the least of which is to give them meaning. But by the very notion they have to 'hold fast to it' implies that they might fall otherwise. Fall into what? Fall into the grey zone that means maybe they *could* have sexual feelings for the opposite sex that are hard to accept, for whatever reason. So being 100% gay, as hard as it used to be in our world, outweighs the intense exploration that would have to be done to fit into their hetero side. Swap this for heteros as well. I'm not discriminating against any group here. There is safety in labels. And this is my point.
    I knew what you meant but chose to ignore it because where it is not wrong it is irrelevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    If it's nurture that implies there was likely some trauma or events that pushed one in that direction, and therefore it is more 'unnatural' for that person.
    No, it does not imply any trauma or bad event. Again, whether it is 'natural' or 'unnatural' makes no difference. Besides, we know it is natural because we see it everywhere in the animal kingdom, even in species that are quite too dumb to suffer from childhood traumas in any meaningful sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    I do not identify as bi.
    The word identifies you so. It is your hat, whether you choose to put it on or leave it.

  6. #86
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    @Johnnyboy

    I am familiar with the concept you bring up to Nicodemus. Yes, I am part of the dominant group in many ways. But one can break out of that dominant group-think by having consciousness about minority groups. The very fact that I am stating that more people would be sexual with same gender partners than is currently happening is an illustration of that. Otherwise, I'd be trying to suppress that minority. So your assumption and analogy is false.

    I want to differentiate what I meant about identifying as gay when young, versus just having gay experiences as one loves someone of the same gender. When I think of hard-core 'homosexuals' or even 'heterosexuals' I have met and know, it is often the case that they have had a traumatic life in some way. Not severe trauma perhaps, but mild trauma, as in a moderately dysfunctional family. Not all of course. Lending credibility to my theory about needing to cling to homosexual (or heterosexual labels) for a reason.
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    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

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  7. #87
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    I knew what you meant but chose to ignore it because where it is not wrong it is irrelevant.


    No, it does not imply any trauma or bad event. Again, whether it is 'natural' or 'unnatural' makes no difference. Besides, we know it is natural because we see it everywhere in the animal kingdom, even in species that are quite too dumb to suffer from childhood traumas in any meaningful sense.


    The word identifies you so. It is your hat, whether you choose to put it on or leave it.
    It is our nature to be 'gay', but it is also in our nature to be 'hetero'. Cows hump each other, but they dang sure take the bull too.

    What is not in our nature is to cling to our sexual orientation. That does come from some sort of defunct in our nurturing environment.

    I am beyond bi. It is a limiting label. But I'll call you gay if you like.
    Ni/Ti/Fe/Si
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    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

    songofmary.wordpress.com


  8. #88
    null Jonny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    I am beyond bi. It is a limiting label. But I'll call you gay if you like.
    From a practical standpoint, in what way do you deviate from those colloquially referred to as bisexual? Please believe me when I say I mean no offense by this question, but do you find animals or any other form of life (or objects, I suppose) sexually appealing? I ask because, if you have found some human males sexually attractive and you have found some human females sexually attractive, but you haven't been sexually attracted to things outside of these two categories, then I would say you are bisexual.

    If not bisexual, perhaps you would consider yourself pansexual?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  9. #89
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    It is our nature to be 'gay', but it is also in our nature to be 'hetero'. Cows hump each other, but they dang sure take the bull too.

    What is not in our nature is to cling to our sexual orientation. That does come from some sort of defunct in our nurturing environment.

    I am beyond bi. It is a limiting label. But I'll call you gay if you like.
    I do not contest the notion that social norms contribute to hetero- and homosexual clinging. That does not mean, however, that there no people who feel a predominant attraction to just one sex, and that they are in the majority in both the hetero- and the homosexual subgroup. I believe most people are a little bi, but just a little.

  10. #90
    The Unwieldy Clawed One Falcarius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Theft is, in any case, natural. If it is not, how can Falcarius tolerate it that computers are legal? They are certainly not natural-normal!

    Unless you want to change the premise of your initial argument, I think you have to surrender now.





    Falcarius was not the one who blames the inadequacy of humanity on animalism by way of irrelevant conclusion. So his opinion on computational theory and the legality of abacuses is quit frankly irrelevant.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thalassa View Post
    Oh our 3rd person reference to ourselves denotes nothing more than we realize we are epic characters on the forum.

    Narcissism, plain and simple.

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