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  1. #1
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Default Puerto Rican majority votes to make territory a state for the first time.

    http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/07/politi...ico/index.html

    Just look it up on Google news or something for tons more articles.

    Domestically, it appears to be caught in some dispute over its legitimacy. Who knows if the Puerto Rican government will act on it. If they do, how will the US government respond? Will we have a 51st state, with 2 more senators and at least one more representative? PR is more populated than quite a lot of states, so in fairness it should have well over one representative.

    How would we even handle this process and how would it change the country?
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  2. #2
    Senior Member UniqueMixture's Avatar
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    Woah crazy. It would tilt things even more democratic I believe. Aside from that you won't need a visa to go to PR so I'm sure smuggling will increase and Americans taking vacations there and stuff. If the union is successful we might eventually have even more countries in the Americas applying for statehood leading to a North American Union (as a corollary to the EU perhaps??) one day. Could be pretty cool
    For all that we have done, as a civilization, as individuals, the universe is not stable, and nor is any single thing within it. Stars consume themselves, the universe itself rushes apart, and we ourselves are composed of matter in constant flux. Colonies of cells in temporary alliance, replicating and decaying and housed within, an incandescent cloud of electrical impulses. This is reality, this is self knowledge, and the perception of it will, of course, make you dizzy.

  3. #3
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UniqueMixture View Post
    Woah crazy. It would tilt things even more democratic I believe. Aside from that you won't need a visa to go to PR so I'm sure smuggling will increase and Americans taking vacations there and stuff. If the union is successful we might eventually have even more countries in the Americas applying for statehood leading to a North American Union (as a corollary to the EU perhaps??) one day. Could be pretty cool
    Big news, indeed.

    Not to bolster what I believe to be misperceptions about me on your part, but I do have mixed feelings about the possibility; namely, that in a country of immigrants, I believe a common language is necessary to facilitate cross-assimilation and cement a common identity for the future descendents of both new arrivals (which I know doesn't apply to Puerto Ricans specifically) and descendents of old arrivals (preferably, they would mostly be the same group within two or three generations). It wouldn't matter much if Puerto Rico were simply regarded as a 'special case', but I worry about the potentially balkanizing impact of its influence on language policy in the mainland, especially in light of the present ethnic divide.

    That said, they're Americans, they are already closely tied to the mainland through familial connections, and they never asked for their island to be made a territory in the first place; if they want in, I think congress should automatically accept them into the union (though the Puerto Ricans should probably wait until they have at least 60% support).

    As for other countries in the Americas seeking statehood, I doubt that it would happen; modern national identities tend to be pretty embedded and internalized relative to earlier times* for a variety of reasons; there are also a variety of linguistic and economic barriers, not to mention small populations in countries which might otherwise be a good fit (such as the Bahamas).

    Regarding a potential American Union, I don't think it would ever work except as an extremely loose confederation; simply put, none of us want the others to tell us what to do, and we have no real fear of breaking out into a huge cotinental war without closer integration, which is what led to the desire (initially only by elites working through gradual beaurocratic inertia) to eventually form the EU.

    *I think the Dominican Republic once asked to be admitted many decades ago, but they were turned down because of racism.

  4. #4
    No moss growing on me Giggly's Avatar
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    Wow.

  5. #5
    Senior Member UniqueMixture's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    Not to bolster what I believe to be misperceptions about me on your part, but I do have mixed feelings about the possibility; namely, that in a country of immigrants, I believe a common language is necessary to facilitate cross-assimilation and cement a common identity for the future descendents of both new arrivals (which I know doesn't apply to Puerto Ricans specifically) and descendents of old arrivals (preferably, they would mostly be the same group within two or three generations).
    There have been many empires that have been multilingual. India, China, Belize, etc are examples of modern multilingual countries. As for the rest of your post I agree. As for the bold, I simply do not understand how what was said in the other thread was in the best interests of the groups discussed there, however I don't really wish to carry on that discussion in this thread I simply didn't know how to respond so I left it alone.






    other possible contenders as states:

    Other less likely contenders are Guam and the United States Virgin Islands, both of which are unincorporated organized territories of the United States. Also, the Northern Mariana Islands, which is a commonwealth like Puerto Rico, and American Samoa, an unorganized, unincorporated territory, could both attempt to gain statehood. Some proposals call for the Virgin Islands to be admitted with Puerto Rico as one state (often known as the proposed "Commonwealth of Prusvi", for Puerto Rico/U.S. Virgin Islands, or as "Puerto Virgo"), and for the amalgamation of U.S. territories or former territories in the Pacific Ocean, in the manner of the "Greater Hawaii" concept of the 1960s. Guam and the Northern Mariana Islands would be admitted as one state, along with Palau, the Federated States of Micronesia, and the Marshall Islands (although these latter three entities are now separate sovereign nations, which have Compact of Free Association relationships with the United States). Such a state would have a population of 412,381 (slightly lower than Wyoming's population) and an area of 911.82 square miles (2,361.6 km2) square miles (slightly smaller than Rhode Island). American Samoa could possibly be part of such a state, increasing the population to 467,900 and the area to 988.65 square miles (2,560.6 km2). Radio Australia, in late May 2008, issued signs of Guam and the Northern Mariana Islands becoming one again and becoming the 51st state.[37]
    Caribbean Territories Location Population Area (sq. mi.) Comments
    Puerto Rico 3,725,789 3,514 2010 U.S. Census results
    United States Virgin Islands 109,750 133.73 2010 U.S. Census results
    Total 3,835,539 3,647.73 Puerto Rico & U.S. Virgin Islands
    Pacific Territories Location Population Area (sq. mi.) Comments
    Northern Mariana Islands 53,883 184.17 2010 U.S. Census results
    Guam 159,358 209.85 2010 U.S. Census results
    Total Mariana Islands 213,241 394.02
    American Samoa 55,519 76.83 2010 U.S. Census results
    Total American Pacific 268,760 988.65
    Marshall Islands 67,182 70 2011 estimate
    Palau 20,958 177 2011 estimate
    Federated States of Micronesia 111,000 271 2009 estimate
    Total Former Trust Territories 199,140 518
    Total 467,900 1506.65
    Philippines

    The Philippines has a small grassroots movement for U.S. statehood. Originally part of the platform of the Progressive Party, then known as the Federalista Party, the party dropped it in 1907, which coincided with the name change.[38][39] As recently as 2004, the concept of the Philippines becoming a U.S. state has been part of a political platform in the Philippines.[40] Supporters of this movement include Filipinos who believe that the quality of life in the Philippines would be higher and that there will be less poverty there if the Philippines were an American state; or at the least, an American territory. Supporters also include Filipinos that had fought as members of the United States Armed Forces in various wars during the Commonwealth period. [41][42]

    Various suggestions for Philippine statehood have included its entry as a whole or the partial entry of the westernized north, leaving the predominantly Muslim parts of Mindanao to form its own country (see Moro National Liberation Front) or join Indonesia. The movement initially had a significant impact during the early American colonial period;[39] It is no longer a mainstream movement,[43] but is a small social movement that gains interest and talk in that nation.[44][45]
    For all that we have done, as a civilization, as individuals, the universe is not stable, and nor is any single thing within it. Stars consume themselves, the universe itself rushes apart, and we ourselves are composed of matter in constant flux. Colonies of cells in temporary alliance, replicating and decaying and housed within, an incandescent cloud of electrical impulses. This is reality, this is self knowledge, and the perception of it will, of course, make you dizzy.

  6. #6
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    Maybe if it becomes a state, San Juan will get an MLB team! (I think it's a big enough city.)

  7. #7
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Meh, the USA is already 37 states too big.
    Take the weakest thing in you
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    So you can let go when you give it

  8. #8
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    @Magic Poriferan : It would have about 5 Representatives (and of course 2 Senators).

    I was so surprised this news wasn't bigger! I told everyone I knew. Not that it's certain yet, but it's closer than ever. And the U.S.A. hasn't had a new state join since around when my father was born.

    The official Presidential, Republican, and Democratic stance is that they'll support whatever the people of Puerto Rico prefer, and I agree with that. The double-referendum was kind of confusing about preferences.... Personally, I think to be fair, it requires a second referendum, narrowing it down to just the two options of Territory(current status) vs. Statehood.

    If the people of Puerto Rico make it clearly known that they want to become a state, then all that needs happen is for the United States Congress to approve to let them join our brotherhood of fifty. But there might be political squabbles about the details in Congress, first. In the past, things like letting in a left-leaning state paired with a right-leaning state at the same time, so as not to disturb the political balance, were common. But things have changed so much since the days when new states were like collectibles...since 1915, very few new ones have been admitted. A hundred years later, I don't know how it will be handled, in respect to parties.

    Maybe it will stall for years. Or maybe it will be over in a week.

    A Puerto Rican member of another forum made another good point: Puerto Ricans want to make sure they get this right before they say "yes" for certain to statehood, considering our "No Backsies" policy on becoming a state, shown in the 1860s.
    Last edited by Cimarron; 11-08-2012 at 03:12 AM. Reason: more info again
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  9. #9
    F CK all I need is U ilikeitlikethat's Avatar
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    Yeah, what's up with PR becomming a state? I mean, I knew it was going to happen, ish, or something, I mean, you can't go to America and not notice stuff that suggests this, in some places.

  10. #10
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    woo hoo

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