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  1. #51
    lurking.... Wyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    I'm covering middle-school knowledge but Impeachment alone doesn't even mean he'd be ousted from his position in the White House anyways.

    I think you're right, Beat.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffster View Post

    That is a gross distortion of facts, a myopic brain fart, and the kind of extremely narrow and sensationalist rhetoric that is the reason more and more people are tuning out of politics all together.
    I understand that it isn't him Alone, my hunch is that he's the puppet that follows Dick Cheney's orders.. but uhm yea you can disagree with what I said and it may be narrowminded but you haven't shown me that I'm wrong so I still stand by my statement. I'd find evidence for my claims but I don't feel like google mining today lol.

  3. #53
    veteran attention whore Jeffster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didums View Post
    I understand that it isn't him Alone, my hunch is that he's the puppet that follows Dick Cheney's orders.. but uhm yea you can disagree with what I said and it may be narrowminded but you haven't shown me that I'm wrong so I still stand by my statement. I'd find evidence for my claims but I don't feel like google mining today lol.
    That's just the point though, most of that isn't factual, thus there is no "evidence" that can prove it right or wrong, it's just political posturing. You have actual factual (sorry) points about the debt and lives lost, as well as the economy (though that one is shaky, because most economic effects take many years to be really felt) that may be largely due to policies of the Bush administration. If you focused on those, you could actually present a valid case for criticism of the president, though it's highly doubtful that they would rise to the level of impeachable offenses.

    Rising gas prices is a red herring, and one easily disproved to be a direct result of Bush policies for anyone who does a little "google mining" as you call it. And "dismantling of the Constitution" is a completely vacuous buzz-phrase with no grounding in reality. The Constitution is as solid as it ever was. It is not the president's job to judge whether policies are constitutional or not, that's the courts' place in government, so by our system the president cannot in fact "dismantle" the Constitution, even if he wanted to.

    And that's the last time I will type constitution on this forum ever, because I screw up that word every time and have to re-type it every single time. Dyslexia sucks sometimes.
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  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffster View Post
    That's just the point though, most of that isn't factual, thus there is no "evidence" that can prove it right or wrong, it's just political posturing.
    Wait for the evidence Kucinich unveils, we're pawns in this country, we really know very little about what is going on in the government.

    You have actual factual (sorry) points about the debt and lives lost, as well as the economy (though that one is shaky, because most economic effects take many years to be really felt) that may be largely due to policies of the Bush administration. If you focused on those, you could actually present a valid case for criticism of the president, though it's highly doubtful that they would rise to the level of impeachable offenses.
    Its not that the president is doing a bad job for those facts. It is that all of that was caused via lies and manipulation from the executive branch. If all the premises of the Iraq war, Afghanistan war, and 9/11 were true, I'd be fine with the result, honestly, sometimes "shit happens". But, the premises were based on deliberate lies in order to follow through with their own agenda, we can see that by looking back through the years and how this has all unfolded. Follow the path of Red herrings that the administration has created.

    Rising gas prices is a red herring, and one easily disproved to be a direct result of Bush policies for anyone who does a little "google mining" as you call it.
    Proof by Assertion I don't see how it is a red herring, I think that the connection between the war in Iraq that Bush started and the tripling of gas prices is completely relevant (it has tripled in the past 6 years.)

    And "dismantling of the Constitution" is a completely vacuous buzz-phrase with no grounding in reality. The Constitution is as solid as it ever was. It is not the president's job to judge whether policies are constitutional or not, that's the courts' place in government, so by our system the president cannot in fact "dismantle" the Constitution, even if he wanted to.
    Good word choice but you are completely wrong. The Executive branch is dominating the others, its simple, the checks and balances aren't being made, that is why there was the hearing in the video I linked, it wasn't for an Impeachment hearing. "the president cannot in fact 'dismante' the constitution", you're kidding, right? All I have to say is Patriot Act to refute that claim lol. He has pulled the same stunt that Hitler did to get around the constitution (Reichstag fire --> Enabling Act of 1933). History repeats itself! Our constitution is just as vulnerable and weak as the rest!

  5. #55
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    I have to agree with Didums, to an extent. Bush alone (or the executive branch as a whole) are not fully to blame for our current state of affairs, but they have made a mockery of the most basic constitutional tenets we hold dear. Of course, every POTUS since FDR has done something impeachable in my opinion. Bush and Co. just happen to have been particularly brazen in this regard.
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