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  1. #21
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    I'm generalizing, but it still applies. He's not psychic. What if they'd fired back?
    That's why he kept shooting, lol.

    Using your logic there's never a good time to fire upon someone that's armed, because they might potentially fire back?

    What if old man rivers wasn't armed and the robbers decided to get rowdy and massacre a group of people, just for fun? Too many what-ifs. Old man did his duty as a concealed weapon holder. Luckily it only resulted in the arrest of those two jackasses. An ideal outcome all things considered.

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by swordpath View Post
    That's why he kept shooting, lol.

    Using your logic there's never a good time to fire upon someone that's armed, because they might potentially fire back?

    What if old man rivers wasn't armed and the robbers decided to get rowdy and massacre a group of people, just for fun? Too many what-ifs. Old man did his duty as a concealed weapon holder. Luckily it only resulted in the arrest of those two jackasses. An ideal outcome all things considered.
    That outcome is no more likely than what I posited. It is a crapshoot. And if it is a crapshoot, how is it "better"?
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  3. #23
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    I'm generalizing, but it still applies. He's not psychic. What if they'd fired back?
    The fact that he caught them totally off guard was a big plus. It's hard to control reflex reactions when someone gets taken by surprise like that, especially if they are getting hydrostatic shocks from the rounds hitting which can rock the brain and entire nervous system.

    He took the initiative, and more importantly he kept it until they left. If he had let up there might have been retaliation possibly.

    There's always a chance that they get shots off but it's less likely if they don't have time to collect themselves.

    Coincidentally this is probably why they were falling over themselves. I bet they were stunned if they got hit anywhere substantial.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Stigmata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by swordpath View Post
    Are you just generalizing, or is this sentiment based off of the video? Who says the man that concealed carry is a gun-loving, fanatic? As this video alone illustrates, there are many times when it is because of responsible citizens that conceal carry, that tragic incidents do not take place or the damage is subdued much more quickly than it otherwise would have.
    Honestly, I think the opening fire in a relatively small area like that had the potential to do more harm than good, even though it worked out better in this particular instance. This time, the perpetrators ran off scared, but what if they'd decided to return fire? It could've been an a complete shoot-out with everyone in the building in the crossfire. What if in his pursuit he'd shot and caused a bullet to ricochet and injured someone?
    "I'm just here so I won't get fined."

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stigmata View Post
    Honestly, I think the opening fire in a relatively small area like that had the potential to do more harm than good, even though it worked out better in this particular instance. This time, the perpetrators ran off scared, but what if they'd decided to return fire? It could've been an a complete shoot-out with everyone in the building in the crossfire. What if in his pursuit he'd shot and caused a bullet to ricochet and injured someone?
    Exactly my point. He's only a hero because of the outcome (which he could not predict). It could've ended very differently and we'd be having a different discussion if bystanders were shot or killed in the ensuing shootout.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  6. #26
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stigmata View Post
    Honestly, I think the opening fire in a relatively small area like that had the potential to do more harm than good, even though it worked out better in this particular instance. This time, the perpetrators ran off scared, but what if they'd decided to return fire? It could've been an a complete shoot-out with everyone in the building in the crossfire. What if in his pursuit he'd shot and caused a bullet to ricochet and injured someone?
    You don't just 'decide' to return fire when you get hit by something that's going somewhere on the order of 'the speed of sound' and with the energy of getting hit by a heart defibrillator not just once, but two or three times at once.

    Yeah, some people pull it off but it's a pretty tall order IMO.

  7. #27
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stigmata View Post
    Honestly, I think the opening fire in a relatively small area like that had the potential to do more harm than good, even though it worked out better in this particular instance. This time, the perpetrators ran off scared, but what if they'd decided to return fire? It could've been an a complete shoot-out with everyone in the building in the crossfire. What if in his pursuit he'd shot and caused a bullet to ricochet and injured someone?
    I hear ya, and I already kind of answered this. You could "what if" all day... The man was concealed carrying, he caught the perps off guard, he took his chances and luckily it worked out alright and no body but the criminals were hurt (and then arrested). Another thing to think about is that these criminals were probably looking for valuables and perhaps on bodies of the patrons of the internet cafe. What happens when they discover old man is carrying a gun?

    I'm what if-ing too, but my point is that you could do that all day. Concealed carry is for the purpose of self defense, and if two men walk into a room and I'm carrying, I'm more than likely not going to think twice but to go for my weapon. In retrospect would I decide I might have done things a little differently, or waited for a more opportune time to brandish my gun? Perhaps. But it's fight or flight and adrenaline in those situations.

  8. #28
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    Go, old man, go!

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by swordpath View Post
    He probably only grazed them and once or twice. Hand guns, shot at moving targets really aren't that accurate. I'd assume less accurate when shot by a senior citizen as well.
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by swordpath View Post
    He probably only grazed them and once or twice. Hand guns, shot at moving targets really aren't that accurate. I'd assume less accurate when shot by a senior citizen as well.
    I think that perhaps he knew what he was doing, which is why I have argued for stricter gun control, so only people who really know what they're doing can carry handguns. Old man probably knew *where* to shoot without killing, but enough to physically incapicitate, and also knew to keep shooting, et al.

    He also didn't hit any by-standers so he must have had practiced aim.

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