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  1. #81
    Habitual Fi LineStepper JocktheMotie's Avatar
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    Quote time, is it?

    "Nationalism is an infantile disease, it is the measles of mankind." Albert Einstein.

    That being said, I find the American version of patriotism to be pretty awesome, and find it's best understood with a bit of humour. While I think senseless nationalism is dumb, a national ideal of "Whateva, I do what I want!" is a perspective I can enjoy.





    I mean, just look at that video. That is wonderful.



  2. #82
    Starcrossed Seafarer Aquarelle's Avatar
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    I love the new HBO show Newsroom.

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIffq85zMI4&feature=related"]It's not.[/YOUTUBE]
    Masquerading as a normal person day after day is exhausting.

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  3. #83
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Given that in this situation one would define best in whatever way they would need to in order for their home country to qualify, I would say that it would be impossible to come to any conclusion as to which country is the best.
    Wait, why would someone do that? Like, why, as a Namibian, would I decide the best country is the country with the most unequal wealth distribution therefore making my country the best? That is exactly the silliest thing about nationalism. Well, either that or the fact that nationalism compels people to forget the worst things about their nation's history.

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    That being said the US is the most powerful, and our consumers serve as the marketplace for many of the worlds products.
    It might have that, but with a gini of 45, the USA is still no where near Namibia's place as the greatest country in the world.

    See, the thing is, I might be more inclined to define a nation's greatness by living standards, or the public utility of its political system, or by the decency of its global conduct. I happen to be an American, but should I seek those standards, I do not find the USA to be the greatest country in the world. Now, why shouldn't I use those standards?

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    There is nothing wrong with reasonable nationalism, and patriotism requires no restraint at all.
    If patriotism means saying your country is great because it is notable for something, and that thing is the best thing to be notable for because your country is notable for it, I must say it is not reasonable.

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    To quote John Adams:
    King George III: There is an opinion among some people, Mr. Adams, that you are not the most attached of all your countrymen to the manners of France?
    John Adams: [laughs] Yes, well, I avow to Your Majesty, that I have no attachment to any country but my own.
    King George III: An honest man will never have any other.
    Wow. I've tried so hard to maintain a certain standard of honesty, but apparently I am a charlatan.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  4. #84
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    I really can't figure out why people can't find a thread more appropriate than the fucking Fourth of July thread to argue why America isn't the greatest nation on earth... In my opinion, it's like waiting 'til Easter or Christmas to walk up to a Christian and bash his/her religion... Obviously, just like any country, it's greatness is up for debate, but apparently common social courtesy is a thing of the past... God, I hate people.
    ...

  5. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    The subjectivity of this word amuses me and patriotism is a poorly defined and largely misused word.

    Nationalism means different things to different people and everyone has separate ideals. Modern patriotism forces people to conform to a singular ideal filled with projections.
    The subjectivity of the word reasonable doesn't keep our entire legal system from employing the reasonable man standard.

    Patriotism - (n) patriotism, nationalism (love of country and willingness to sacrifice for it) "they rode the same wave of popular patriotism"; "British nationalism was in the air and patriotic sentiments ran high"

    One can argue that patriotism also includes never turning a blind eye to one's country's problems, even on national days. Those people who refuse to shoot fireworks and get caught up in celebrations and even choose to protest on a National Day are no less patriotic than those who wave flags and throw confetti.

    It's a different kind of patriotism, but if the heart is in the right place - i.e. promotion of moving a country in a positive direction - then they are equally patriotic.
    One can't argue that turning a blind eye to the problems of the country is Patriotism. If you were to argue that, the problem would be with your understanding of Patriotism, not Patriotism itself.

    Patriotism means having love for your country, and the willingness to fight for whats right for that country regardless if whether what's right agrees with what the current government is doing.

    Choosing to protest can be patriotic as long as you believe your fighting for what's in the best interest of the nation.

    Choosing not to participate in national holiday's does no such thing. It's fine not to participate. And choosing not to celebrate is not unpatriotic, but non participating shouldn't be looked at in the same light as (hopefully justified) protest.

    Disliking a country generally or being a damp towel doesn't do anything for anyone.

    Choosing to take part in a celebration commemorating your countries decision to cast off the chains of subjugation is patriotic. While protesting can also be patriotic, raining on the parade of those that choose to participate in the festivities is not.

  6. #86
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    I stayed inside all day, forraged the corners of my fridge for acceptable foodstuffs and played videogames. The best parts of holidays for me is the day off.

  7. #87
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    I really can't figure out why people can't find a thread more appropriate than the fucking Fourth of July thread to argue why America isn't the greatest nation on earth... In my opinion, it's like waiting 'til Easter or Christmas to walk up to a Christian and bash his/her religion... Obviously, just like any country, it's greatness is up for debate, but apparently common social courtesy is a thing of the past... God, I hate people.
    I see a thread on a forum and I immediately see it as something that invites debate about its topic.

    You apparently see this thread as being more like a church. Of course, I've never been the type to silence my beliefs in or around a church anyhow,
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquarelle View Post
    I love the new HBO show Newsroom.

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lIffq85zMI4&feature=related"]It's not.[/YOUTUBE]
    As do I.

  9. #89
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    I see a thread on a forum and I immediately see it as something that invites debate about its topic.

    You apparently see this thread as being more like a church. Of course, I've never been the type to silence my beliefs in or around a church anyhow,
    A church? No, not quite. I just see a problem with bashing a nation on it's national holiday... But then again, I don't enjoy pissing people off.
    ...

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    But then again, I don't enjoy pissing people off.
    An admirable trait to be sure.

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