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  1. #31
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jontherobot View Post
    What country was it that has a 100 percent ban on guns, but the highest stabbings per capita? I remember reading about it somewhere.
    I don't know, but that's part of what I was getting at. People seem to think that if we get rid of guns, violent crime will disappear.

    That's simply not the case, obviously. Some people object to the "unfair advantage" one has when wielding a gun against an unarmed opponent, but that advantage applies to all weapons.

    *Shrug* I simply don't know what people are hoping to solve by getting rid of guns. The use of guns are a symptom, not a cause. Humans are fragile creatures, banning guns simply means that people will kill each other with different means.
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  2. #32
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    The problem I have with this stance is that no one seems to be able to give a clear answer as to what constitutes a weapon. I can kill you just as dead with a brick or a hammer as I can with an assault rifle or katana.
    Yet you see a clear difference between a brick and an assault rifle. One is built to attack, harm, destroy, kill, the other is not. I am sure, though, if you want to, you can make the distinction quite troublesome. But if, for the time being, we can settle for projectile-shooting devices, a great deal of pain could be avoided.

    When the time has come that a significant number of people are actually thinking about banning guns, I doubt the exact definition will pose a big problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    *Shrug* I simply don't know what people are hoping to solve by getting rid of guns. The use of guns are a symptom, not a cause. Humans are fragile creatures, banning guns simply means that people will kill each other with different means.
    The difference lies in the numbers, and the difference in numbers lies in the ease with which one can kill. I certainly prefer a killer with a knife to one with a rifle.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    I don't know, but that's part of what I was getting at. People seem to think that if we get rid of guns, violent crime will disappear.

    That's simply not the case, obviously. Some people object to the "unfair advantage" one has when wielding a gun against an unarmed opponent, but that advantage applies to all weapons.

    *Shrug* I simply don't know what people are hoping to solve by getting rid of guns. The use of guns are a symptom, not a cause. Humans are fragile creatures, banning guns simply means that people will kill each other with different means.

    Yar. Someday we'll be where we just don't want to kill people... period. And I will shoot things in celebration.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mia. View Post
    The constitution is a document of principles.
    The point still stands.

    I'd credit technology as being the cause of the unprecedented levels of "freedom, opportunity and abundance" we've achieved, if indeed those levels are in fact unprecedented (which they aren't). But that's off topic...

  5. #35
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    If there were a way to take all weapons away with a single push of the button, I would do it. It is, of course, difficult to take them away when everybody is already armed. I assume it will take the US at least a century to realize that the king of England and 'the government' are less threatening to the people than millions of guns in the hands of the crazy.
    I wouldn't. That would take the importance of physical strength to undesired levels. Violent people are usually stronger than peaceful people.
    -----------------

    A man builds. A parasite asks 'Where is my share?'
    A man creates. A parasite says, 'What will the neighbors think?'
    A man invents. A parasite says, 'Watch out, or you might tread on the toes of God... '


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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by xisnotx View Post
    The point still stands.

    I'd credit technology as being the cause of the unprecedented levels of "freedom, opportunity and abundance" we've achieved, if indeed that level is in fact unprecedented (which it isn't). But that's off topic...
    ....and completely flies in the face of an understanding of U.S. history 101 as well.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Yet you see a clear difference between a brick and an assault rifle. One is built to attack, harm, destroy, kill, the other is not. I am sure, though, if you want to, you can make the distinction quite troublesome. But if, for the time being, we can settle for projectile-shooting devices, a great deal of pain could be avoided.
    It is equally “built” to defend, protect, secure, deter, and inhibit. It is a neutral tool. It is a tool to be used which may be neither to attack, harm, destroy, kill, or otherwise. The user is the one who determines what it will be used to do. And in the vast majority of cases, that is to aid society. And in the ones where it is not, they get them illegally anyway.

    At the root of this issue is the notion that we can and will eradicate evil. We cannot. We must rather defend against it and hold it off by active force.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mia. View Post
    ....and completely flies in the face of an understanding of U.S. history 101 as well.
    Simply because U.S. history is taught from an American perspective. America is one of a long line of powers that have existed. It wasn't the first, it won't be the last.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by xisnotx View Post
    Simply because U.S. history is taught from an American perspective.
    No, because it is objectively qualifiable and quantifiable.

    Quote Originally Posted by xisnotx View Post
    America is one of a long line of powers that have existed. It wasn't the first,.
    No, but for all of its many flaws, it was the best.

    Quote Originally Posted by xisnotx View Post
    it won't be the last.
    You're right about this.

  10. #40
    Sweet Ocean Cloud SD45T-2's Avatar
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    When seconds count the cops are just minutes away: http://officersmith.blogspot.com/201...lp-police.html

    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    I think it's important to keep in mind that restrictive laws work mostly against ''peaceful'' people, as criminals won't hand over their guns because of that. So in a way, it is a very unfair situation.
    That's true. And most criminals who use guns get them on the black market.

    There are a lot of guys in San Quentin and Folsom for armed robbery. If you were to ask them if they thought they could get a gun after they got out, they would tell you (truthfully) that they would be able to get guns on the black market and being doing armed robberies again within a couple hours of being released if they wanted to.
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