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  1. #21
    defying your expectations SoraMayhem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    I should also note that I think the term "genderqueer" is different than "queer."
    *shrug* YYMV, but before I embraced my gender dysphoria, I was 'pansexual' and still preferred the term 'queer' as a catch-all.
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  2. #22
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    Words don't lose negative connotations by being forbidden, but they may lose them by being used differently. Allowing it for a single group while disallowing it to others actively enhances any us-versus-them mentality that already existed, in this case effectively encouraging racism. I would argue that the best way for this (and any) word to be reclaimed is to accept it in any form that is not deliberately offensive, regardless of speaker or audience.

  3. #23
    defying your expectations SoraMayhem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dala View Post
    Words don't lose negative connotations by being forbidden, but they may lose them by being used differently. Allowing it for a single group while disallowing it to others actively enhances any us-versus-them mentality that already existed, in this case effectively encouraging racism. I would argue that the best way for this (and any) word to be reclaimed is to accept it in any form that is not deliberately offensive, regardless of speaker or audience.
    Are you suggesting that privileged groups are being discriminated against by being 'disallowed' to use slurs?
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  4. #24
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by raine_lynn View Post
    *shrug* YYMV, but before I embraced my gender dysphoria, I was 'pansexual' and still preferred the term 'queer' as a catch-all.
    Well, it's not really just "my mileage," it seems in this area that "genderqueer" is a transgender thing and "queer" is a gay thing. I thought you were gay when you said you used the term for yourself.

    ... wondering if Gen Y and younger is using the language differently, at least within the subculture and/or political activist mindset. I didn't hang out at Mazzonni PTHC this past weekend, but I wonder if I would have heard the term used more widely there, the demographic is much younger.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by raine_lynn View Post
    Are you suggesting that privileged groups are being discriminated against by being 'disallowed' to use slurs?
    Of course they are, unless you're using a different definition of discrimination than I am. To clarify, I am using the following definition:

    discrimination: to make a distinction in favor of or against a person or thing on the basis of the group, class, or category to which the person or thing belongs rather than according to actual merit

    Basically, my assertion is that you can't discourage racism by actively allowing/disallowing things based on race.

  6. #26
    defying your expectations SoraMayhem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    ... wondering if Gen Y and younger is using the language differently, at least within the subculture and/or political activist mindset. I didn't hang out at Mazzonni PTHC this past weekend, but I wonder if I would have heard the term used more widely there, the demographic is much younger.
    This probably has quite a bit to do with it. The crowds I run with tend to be mid-twenties, and for the most part we tend to use the same terms.

    Quote Originally Posted by dala View Post
    Of course they are, unless you're using a different definition of discrimination than I am. To clarify, I am using the following definition:

    discrimination: to make a distinction in favor of or against a person or thing on the basis of the group, class, or category to which the person or thing belongs rather than according to actual merit

    Basically, my assertion is that you can't discourage racism by actively allowing/disallowing things based on race.
    Okay, just for future reference, it would've been made more clear that was what you were implying had you not used the term 'racism', since that's a misnomer. White people can not experience racism (power + prejudice) because white people are the ones with institutional power over racial minorities.
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  7. #27
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    It would be interesting to see how other demographic regions pan out (like the mid-west, west coast, Seattle/Oregon area, etc.) Along with the age subgroups (Gen Y, Gen X, Boomer) as well as the gender divide (lesbians vs gays).

    As for tranny, down in Alabama I suspect I'd get the "What, missy, you want someone to fix your car?" look, ha!

    I should also note that I think the term "genderqueer" is different than "queer."
    I don't consider myself "queer" (according to the definition I know) but I know a few people who do (mid-20s, Canada). In my experience it has been used as a self-identifier rather than a slur or even a description used by other people. It could probably be used offensively, but then so could many other words.

    I don't really like the word, not because I think it's offensive but because it's so vague and half the people using it disagree on the definition, but that's another topic.
    -end of thread-

  8. #28
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dala View Post
    Basically, my assertion is that you can't discourage racism by actively allowing/disallowing things based on race.
    Particularly if the thing allowed/disallowed is an ubiquitous cultural phenomenon within one group while being disallowed for another group-it casually separates people into ingroups and outgroups and discourages cross-assimilation.

    And no, I don't want permission to use the N word.....I'm saying attempts to 'take it back' have negative social consequences.

  9. #29
    XES 5231311252's Avatar
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    Technically the word "nigga" is different from the word 'nigger', just as 'niggardly' is not the same. Furthermore, the term 'nigger' was not originally a pejorative but a bastardized version of the Spanish word for black (Negro, which came from the Latin word Niger). Kind of like the Swastika being turned into a symbol of hate, when it was and still is used for positive purposes. So IMO, they're not trying to turn a pejorative term into a positive one (one that wasn't negative in the first place) because these are two different words.

    I personally think it's a waste for anyone to be offended by any word or any symbol when these things can easily be twisted to mean something else. Furthermore, Gwen was simply referring to the song by it's title and both those fuckers knew this title was going to cause problems. So if anyone wants to have a problem, it should be with Kanye and Jay-Z.
    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    Why is it that of all the minority groups, there remains a persistent segment of the female community that is determined to own the pejorative once directed at them rather than just discard it? Why try to repurpose and reclaim it, then criticize non-females for following the lead? The reason the word won't die is because they won't let it. I don't run around calling my male members dicks or my gay relations faggots. Seems like common sense to me. I know there are plenty of female folks that feel the same way as I do (my female relations for starters), but some people didn't get the memo.

    So, what gives?
    Same goes for dyke, faggot, tranny, wetback and etc etc. Have you even tried asking the people who say it why they use it?
    “'Fuck', I think. What a beautiful word. If I could say only one thing for the rest of my life, that would be it.”

  10. #30
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5231311252 View Post
    ... both those fuckers knew this title was going to cause problems. So if anyone wants to have a problem, it should be with Kanye and Jay-Z.
    goddammit someone just used the F word, what the fuck???
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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