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  1. #21
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    You are croatian if I remember correctly...at the moment it's no different from other "western" countries, really.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

  2. #22
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    This would be considered "cheating."



    Why can't you have something in between? Is it the nature of your culture to be extreme? The U.S. is a very extreme culture as well, as opposed to some Western European countries which seem much more balanced to me.

    1. Well I am not saying that we will become the most capitalistic counrty in the world but as usuall the black and white approach will do it's thing.


    2. Cheating ? I have done something similar to that a number of time. Actually it has even happened to me that a teacher said " You know , today is such a lousy day and I dont have the desire to correct the schedueled exam that I have with you. So get yourself a paper and write all of the answers from your notebooks on the paper/test. Just so that I have some evidance".



    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    You are croatian if I remember correctly...at the moment it's no different from other "western" countries, really.

    As I said: if you take things at the face value this is correct , but when you start digging and search for more subtile things there are differances. (But ok, since "western countries" is a very wide term actually. Some are more similar some are totally different)

  3. #23
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I'd just like to say in relation to the point about fostering independence and competition that those were not considered valuable features of capitalism by the first political economists and its supporters, Quaker and other paternalistic capitalists, like Rowntree and Cadburies in the UK, praised capitalism and trade because it brought people together, to produce and to consume or exchange goods. It is a sort of proto-socialism to some but I assure you that Rowntrees and Cadburies wherent and arent socialist (I cant remember which one sold out to Kraft but they wrote about it and said so).

    About competition, competition was never seen as a plus in and off itself, it was only considered a means to turn the natural or prevalent unsocial or anti-social traits to social and beneficiant ends, Smith and Mill and other early classical economists all thought it would be better if co-operation could prevail and eradicate any possibility of combines, cartels or conspiracies against employees or consumers but until that where the case competition would achieve the same results.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Cheating ? I have done something similar to that a number of time. Actually it has even happened to me that a teacher said " You know , today is such a lousy day and I dont have the desire to correct the schedueled exam that I have with you. So get yourself a paper and write all of the answers from your notebooks on the paper/test. Just so that I have some evidance".
    This is more of a social issue than an economic one. In more Westernized countries, individual achievement and personal merit in school is extremely important. As such, taking credit for another person's work is far less tolerated I personally find it important because if you can't do the work, then you don't have the skills you'll need later. An engineering student who doesn't understand physics creates bridges that collapse.

    Back on economic systems, I think mixed economies are the most effective approach. Public goods like road infrastructure, emergency services, and parks can be handled most effectively when socialized, industries like banking and communications work best when carefully regulated, and the goods and services that have low barriers to entry and limited impact on public safely (most businesses) work best under something close to pure capitalism with basic minimum standards tacked on.

  5. #25
    Senior Member UniqueMixture's Avatar
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    It sucks. Either you're working a lot making shit tons of money but have very high stress with little free time or you've got less stress and more freedom, but a lot less $$$. Whatever happened to inventing robots for the betterment of society so we could pursue enlightenment?

    @dala ime the most corrupt, vain, and morally questionable tend to be over represented in positions of power even in fields like IT (I would say especially so). The stupid politician w zero understanding of physics gets the bridges built especially the "bridges to nowhere"

    @FDG I think the uk/usa & japan display the worst characteristics of capitalism disproportionately
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    For all that we have done, as a civilization, as individuals, the universe is not stable, and nor is any single thing within it. Stars consume themselves, the universe itself rushes apart, and we ourselves are composed of matter in constant flux. Colonies of cells in temporary alliance, replicating and decaying and housed within, an incandescent cloud of electrical impulses. This is reality, this is self knowledge, and the perception of it will, of course, make you dizzy.

  6. #26
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Why is this in the "relationships" subforum?
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  7. #27
    Administrator highlander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Why is this in the "relationships" subforum?
    Moved.

    It is hard to say what it is like to live in a capitalist society when you have never experienced anything else. I'm a somewhat entrepreneurial person so I guess I am suited for it.

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  8. #28
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    I have yet to see a capitalist system where no one was more disadvantaged as a direct result of the capitalist system. In theory, there are ways in which that loss can be compensated for, but that hasn't worked so well in practice, historically.

    I also agree with Marm, to a degree, about competition in society. That competition is especially visible when you talk to wealthy conservatives, you start to see the mindset of "Wealthy people are wealthy because they earned it, and if you're poor, you obviously are either lazy or stupid." Which, in my opinion, is an irrational degree of faith in the power of capitalist competition to raise the most deserving to the positions that best suit them. The world is more complicated than that.
    The observation that leaps to mind most readily is that everything is driven by money. This includes education (especially college), medical services, where you can live, and whether you have the wherewithal to fight injustice that befalls you. Put another way, finite resources are rationed based upon ability to pay rather than ability to benefit, or merit, or maximizing common good, or any other basis.

    Many things are indeed dictated by powerful corporations, powerful because they have alot of money and use it to buy influence in the government. An individual with a complaint against such an entity (defective products, bad working conditions, pollution, etc.) is like David fighting Goliath. The recent U.S. Supreme Court decision equating campaign contributions to "free speech" institutionalized the influence of money in politics more than ever before.

    Other economic systems may have similar downsides. I'm not suggesting Capitalism is any worse. I have no real basis for comparsion. It does have these problems, though.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  9. #29
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    Why is this in the "relationships" subforum?
    I was at least trying to get the personal "opinions" from people and how has capitalism effected their growth. But it seems that my intuition was right about the fact that this will eventualy end up in politics. (even if I am not up for serious academic debate)

  10. #30
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    As I said: if you take things at the face value this is correct , but when you start digging and search for more subtile things there are differances. (But ok, since "western countries" is a very wide term actually. Some are more similar some are totally different)
    Well, Italy is vastly corrupt, aswell - and many public services are still fully state-owned. However, when I speak with an american I cannot notice really strong divergences between our thinking patterns in terms of how the economic system of our countries works, on a baseline level.
    ENTj 7-3-8 sx/sp

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