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View Poll Results: Are you happy with the removal of habeas corpus?

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19. You may not vote on this poll
  • Of course! We must be extra careful in times of war.

    0 0%
  • Of course not! Evidence connecting the accused to the crime is necessary.

    18 94.74%
  • It doesn't matter to me, I'm not a terrorist.

    1 5.26%
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Results 11 to 14 of 14

  1. #11
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Did you read what I posted?

    I said I don't see any problem with you having the same rights as us. However, the current laws don't provide you with those rights and so I think foreigners should know they travel here at their own risk.
    Ah, I read into your tone that you were effectively saying "and if foreigners travel here that's ok as long as you tell them there is a risk to them". Looks like I am wrong and you are indeed pretty horrified you're country might deny rights that one might call... civilised.. then I am happy to apologise! My bad!

    Anyway, I suppose I ought to answer the original post. Difficult times as these should allow short periods of independently authorised detentions... so that a judge could authorise holding someone for say a week. At least that way, if it were wrong, it doesnt end the person's life, it's just inconvenient (if pretty horrid). But holding people for years etc without trial or any reasonable human rights access is barbaric.

  2. #12
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    Ah, I read into your tone that you were effectively saying "and if foreigners travel here that's ok as long as you tell them there is a risk to them". Looks like I am wrong and you are indeed pretty horrified you're country might deny rights that one might call... civilised.. then I am happy to apologise! My bad!
    I wouldn't say "horrified". That is simply the way America is at the moment. We have gone through far worse periods in our history. The paranoia resulting from Pearl Harbor lead us to locking up Japanese Americans, actual American citizens, in detention camps. That is horrific. I can't imagine that anywhere near as many people have been hurt by this policy and it will eventually be revoked. I just don't believe in getting all passionately enraged about it, when the legal system will take its natural course.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Honestly, if you are concerned with how the US conducts itself overseas then go do something about it. Campaign or write letters. It seems kindof silly to me to sit on the internet, read about all these "alleged" actions, and then take no action yourself aside form spreading it on the internet like it is fact without any evidence to support the speculations aside from the isolated stories.
    Here you go again, calling people out. You're so annoying.

    How many causes are you personally involved with? I don't want to hear you complain about anything, ever, not even a little bit, until you can provide proof that you're doing something substantial, and not just bitching over the internet.

    Wait, this is internet discussion. Lighten the fuck up. Your bravado is transparent.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #14
    Senior Member Dark Razor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiddo View Post
    Quite a bit of speculation there based on a few isolated stories.

    Honestly, if you are concerned with how the US conducts itself overseas then go do something about it. Campaign or write letters. It seems kindof silly to me to sit on the internet, read about all these "alleged" actions, and then take no action yourself aside form spreading it on the internet like it is fact without any evidence to support the speculations aside from the isolated stories.
    Actually there are quite a few documented cases where the CIA has arbitrarily abducted foreign citizens and held and tortured them without trial in the CIA Gulag system. The CIA can therefor be recognized as a criminal organization, and, on other grounds, as a terrorist organization, though this applies to basically all secret services of the world.

    Personally I think that the "threat" posed by terrorism is neglegible and does not warrant police-state legislation. Such legislation though is unfortunately also increasingly passed in the EU. I understand the UK is doing all it can to make the 1984 vision into reality, and other countries are probably not far behind.

    Can you top the irony?

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