Once again- why does it matter where we came from socially- shouldn't the future count more?
Sorry- I just thought that was a relevant point that was being completely ignored in an INFJ-INFJ argument
That is exactly the point I addressed in my argument. This is purely observational. The past tells us where we are going to end up if we don't find a different way. The only argument I am willing to make is humans have a responsiblity to this planet to limit their population but that idea goes completely contrary to theological principles such as capitalism.
in fact, i think everything is "natural". i'm confused about what kiddo means when he uses the word.
i really need to know the definition you're using, kiddo.
Natural means what is observed in nature. It is observed in nature that bonobos form egalitarian and matriarchal societies that compete against other bonobo societies. Since they are our closest hominid relative in terms of genetics, it is probably safe to assume that we are programmed in much the same way. However we have developed concepts based on supernatural principles, those which are not observed in nature, such as the concept of "property". These concepts are unnatural, since they are not observed in nature. There is no "property" in nature, only territory which is earned and kept via force and coercion.