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  1. #21
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Interacting with the system and working within it are two different things.

    Attracting attention and increasing awareness are only the first part of a combo.
    I agree. But as soon as the Republican party legitimized the Tea Party they got weaker. I think it's going to take 3 or 4 years until there's enough support from every spectrum of politics to say "hey! stop screwing over democracy by making this entirely about money and making votes useless!"

    We're not there yet. It's on its way there.I think making this a party makes it political in a partisan way. I think saying out of partisan politics is necessary to achieve the goal.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  2. #22
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    I prefer we just set up guillotines and start chopping our upper classes heads off.
    Ground control to Major Tom

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Depends how you determine share, they'll say that they dont use any of the social goods taxes are spent on, wether its services or public paths and street lighting.

    The thing about money in the economy, circulating, is that poor people or people who've been poor but now have money, usually public employees actually, is that they spend money, often as soon as they have it, while rich people who make even more money are less inclined to do anything other than save it. There's no trickle down or externalities of an indirectly beneficial kind associated with rich people saving money. Although there is nothing intrinsically unfair about that.
    That is indeed true; if those with more income hoard their wealth then it hurts the greater good, as it privatizes and stagnates wealth from the collective whole of society. However, some would argue that such economic policies that enable that sort of saving may actually be intrinsically unfair given the result of how accumalted wealth doesn't trickle down back into society. Of course though we as a society can't just take any portion of wealth arbitrarily from the wealthy, thus this is why I usually advocate progressive taxes for those who usually have more (although in limited instances only; I'm against taxing people whom win large sums of money or welath via lotterys and game shows, or taxing those whom inherent things from others, given that such high taxes actaully can hurt the poor more so than they hurt the rich).

    There's not even any way in which rich people could buy social goods, like street lighting, these days because most of the rich have specialised in removing themselves from public life or society generally per se or they've gotten together with others like them for that purpose, so they'll individually or within their community of rich people pay for street lighting but no risk of anyone whose likely to be considered a free loader accidentially benefiting. Who thinks like that? Seriously? Still, its how it is.
    I don't enitrely agree with the notion that rich people can't buy social goods nor fund their wealth back into the mainstream of society; some of the richest people in the world constantly donate money to charity while other invest their money into business and increased economic infrastructure, which of course create jobs and consumer products. Now as for rich elitist communites, I've actually never heard of such communities existing, although I suppose it is possible (and plausible as well); precisely which communities live in such a manner (or were you speaking generally?).

    Also, as much as I don't like the rich hoarding their wealth, I'm not against it simply due to the fact that those who do possess a large sum of money can do good with it. The generosity of the wealthy exists in their individual ability to both care for the community and to assist them with those means. A man of good will can only do so much for society, but a man of good will with millions of dollars can cause great impact upon the world, thus bettering the lives of the lower class (and possibly enabling economic mobility) and strengthen the economy in total. Of course though, such people of good will tend to be more scarce than not, and most people are still naturally inclined to thier own selfish desires.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy View Post
    I prefer we just set up guillotines and start chopping our upper classes heads off.
    Unfortunately, we don't even know whose heads to chop off thanks to corporate anonymity. Personal responsibility does not apply to the wealthy.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  5. #25
    Crazy Diamond Billy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Unfortunately, we don't even know whose heads to chop off thanks to corporate anonymity. Personal responsibility does not apply to the wealthy.
    Then we go to their gated communities. Rip down the gates and take them to the streets. Finding the money isnt hard, I suggest starting in Greenwich CT.
    Ground control to Major Tom

  6. #26
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy View Post
    Then we go to their gated communities. Rip down the gates and take them to the streets. Finding the money isnt hard, I suggest starting in Greenwich CT.
    Yeah...I'm going to step away from this conversation.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage Idealist View Post
    I don't enitrely agree with the notion that rich people can't buy social goods nor fund their wealth back into the mainstream of society; some of the richest people in the world constantly donate money to charity while other invest their money into business and increased economic infrastructure, which of course create jobs and consumer products. Now as for rich elitist communites, I've actually never heard of such communities existing, although I suppose it is possible (and plausible as well); precisely which communities live in such a manner (or were you speaking generally?).
    Its not that they cant, its that they choose not to, there are exceptions but its the norm for them not to and in the class of upper middle income groups which matter the most for money circulating in a local or national economy its definitely not the norm to give your money away or condone taxation.

    Most of the means of "giving" are within or through exclusive avenues, churches, schools, neighbourhood groups, country clubs, which mean it circulates, if it does among the elite.

    The communities I'm talking about are not conspiratorial entites or there's not a lot of deliberation involved in what I'm talking about, although you're bound to have seen walled estates, exclusive neighbourhoods for the wealthy and upwardly fiscally mobile? I'd be surprised if you havent heard of this at all.

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