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  1. #81
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giggly View Post
    I'm American and I have national pride, and people, including Americans, seem to hate this. There are ugly things in many nations history but there are also wonderful things to celebrate as well.
    National Pride Denial should be a capital offence.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  2. #82
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LEGERdeMAIN View Post
    That makes so much sense. I pray to the gods every day asking for a culture.
    No wonder they specialize in single-crop farming.
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

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  3. #83
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    1/ We shall see very soon if Le Pen is so popular than what you claim she is.
    There's very serious review who think she is.







    etc.

    Of course, you can believe that it's bullshit, but it's your personal belief and nothing more, and it would stay true that Le Pen's ideas has been normalised.

    2/ Lots of other writers sell lots of books. Obviously, you seem obsessed with only a tiny reactionary group of them. Why?
    Lot of writer sell lots of book but they are not at the first range in library, with books glorifying Jeanne d'Arc and the general de Gaulle. It's a social phenomenon, you are blind if you don't accept to see it.


    Absolutely not.
    Did you guy listen the Hollande's rant at the Bourget about the "rêve français". It's only that: France is a ntion so human and so special, France is made to be an heaven of peace and social justice, etc. If a politician want to be popular he must avoid to criticize the french welfare system or to minimize the value of french culture, the whole point of the french foreing policy is that "France is the heir of French Revolution and our intervention in the world is necessary to defend human rights."


    Unless, of course you believe that what you read in far right foras is the truth.
    I never go on far right foras. You don't know me and you don't know what you are talking about. So stop to make assumtions about me, you are not in position to do it.


    Most of libertarians are just a different breed of far right fascists. Anybody believing in social darwinism or in nonsensical Ayn Rand theories is. And deeply immature, I should add.
    Most part of libertarians don't defend social darwinism, libertarianism and SD are two things which are ultimately differents. If you were less immature, you would take time to learn and stop to make gross and wrong associations and generalisations about concept that you visibly don't understand.

    No wonder you would:

    1/ get along so well with true self-declared far right French fascists like the kind of Redscorpion
    I simply agreed with him to say that you minimized the criminality problems in France. That does'nt make me a fascist. Except in he typical leftist's sight where everyone who disagrees with him is a fascist.

    2/ use the same vocabulary or sayings that far right French fascists
    What vocabulary?

    3/ be persuaded that far right political rants theories should be popular, if you weren't attracted to them, somehow.
    Lol.

    Do you think that Marianne's journalists, for example, are attracted to far right's ideas too?

    Laughable.


    No, you were trolling. And Riva is too far away from France to realize what kind of bullshit you were posting.
    Says the guy who lives in Morrocco.


    I'm sorry if your lame joke didn't work.
    But frankly: grow up!
    My joke worked since it was simply about mocking the nationalists french beliefs and that Riva laughed.

    And I'm not sure why I have to grow up. Because your "argumentation" is lame, full of ignorance and next to the plate?
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

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    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  4. #84
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post

    Of course, you can believe that it's bullshit, but it's your personal belief and nothing more, and it would stay true that Le Pen's ideas has been normalised.
    Why are you so obsessed with Marine Le Pen?

    All I see is that you're doing here a lot of free advertisement for her...

    *hint* *hint*



    Lot of writer sell lots of book but they are not at the first range in library, with books glorifying Jeanne d'Arc and the general de Gaulle. It's a social phenomenon, you are blind if you don't accept to see it.
    Then I am blind, then my librarian is blind... and so on...

    Either you're trolling, either you're trying to generalize French fascists ideas, and imagine they're everywhere. Then I should ask: why?

    If a politician want to be popular he must avoid to criticize the french welfare system or to minimize the value of french culture
    Absurd and wrong.

    the whole point of the french foreing policy is that "France is the heir of French Revolution and our intervention in the world is necessary to defend human rights."
    Absolutely not. You're forgetting neo-colonialism, which is much more important in the current French foreign policy.


    I never go on far right foras. You don't know me and you don't know what you are talking about. So stop to make assumtions about me, you are not in position to do it.
    Then:

    1/ Why are you talking like a fascist?
    2/ Why are you getting along along so well with fascists?
    3/ Why are explaining us that they are soooo popular, and that their ideas are soooo interesting?
    4/ Why do you seem so obsessed with Le Pen and Joan of Arc?

    Don't assume everybody here is a moron and can't read between the lines.


    Most part of libertarians don't defend social darwinism, libertarianism and SD are two things which are ultimately differents. If you were less immature, you would take time to learn and stop to make gross and wrong associations and generalisations about concept that you visibly don't understand.
    Please, continue... I don't bother.



    I simply agreed with him to say that you minimized the criminality problems in France. That does'nt make me a fascist. Except in he typical leftist's sight where everyone who disagrees with him is a fascist.
    That's not only that, but that was another big clue concerning your true political beliefs.

    Once again, don't assume everybody here is a moron.

    Do you think that Marianne's journalists, for example, are attracted to far right's ideas too?
    Of course yes. It makes them sell.

    Demagogy is a good subject, whether it is leftist or rightist demagogy.


    Says the guy who lives in Morrocco.
    Perhaps that simply means:

    1/ I know Maghrebian culture way better than French far right fascists do, and have no stupid prejudice against anybody a little bit too dark skinned for your taste.
    2/ I'm not afraid to live amongst Arabs or North Africans. As I explained months earlier, I think I have a fairly good knowledge of what is really going on within the French suburbs.
    3/ I do not consider immigration to be the source of all criminality in France, just like you seemed to do.
    4/ I'm not the "bobo" caricature you thought I were.


    And I'm not sure why I have to grow up. Because your "argumentation" is lame, full of ignorance and next to the plate?
    And:

    1/ you should be aware that the saying "next to the plate" is not necessarily understood by our non-French readers

    2/ I think you're slightly younger than me, and that many people here already complained against your brash, ignorant, and immature teen-like attitude. Why? Is it an international plot specifically directed against your person? Anything else?
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

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  5. #85
    Senior Member captain curmudgeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Now I know this doesn't generalize to every single American that ever lived, but it's common enough to note:

    Americans all know their gazillion presidents from memory. They can tell you all sorts of details about important historical moments in the formation of their nation.
    You REALLY overestimate the intelligence of the American public.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-country.html
    Granted, I did have to know many of these things starting rather early in my schooling, but I went to a pretty good school; there's also the disparity between what the average person learns in school and what they actually retain throughout life.

  6. #86
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wheelchairdoug View Post
    You REALLY overestimate the intelligence of the American public.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...s-country.html
    Granted, I did have to know many of these things starting rather early in my schooling, but I went to a pretty good school; there's also the disparity between what the average person learns in school and what they actually retain throughout life.
    But thats not an american-only problem. If you run around here and ask who the current president is, you wont get too satisfieing answers as well (Except if he has bad press like atm). "A Wulff in sheep's clothing" <- I love that one
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  7. #87
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Romanticism and the Enlightenment

    Today the 26th of January we celebrate Australia Day.

    On the face of it we celebrate the arrival of the First Fleet in Sydney Cove in 1788.

    But behind the smiling face of Australia Day are the propagandists.

    The Black Armband propagandists call it Invasion Day that destroyed idyllic tribal life.

    And the Advance Australia propagandists say we were lucky to be settled by the best of Western Civlization, and in particular the Scottish and English Enlightenment.

    The Black Armband are part of Romanticism which is a reaction to the Enlightenment.

  8. #88
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    Why are you so obsessed with Marine Le Pen?

    All I see is that you're doing here a lot of free advertisement for her...

    *hint* *hint*
    One minute, sir.

    I recall you what happened.


    Me: "And you, please, stop to play the naive bobo and admit that what I said is true for many french."

    You: "It isn't, unless you spend all your time in France socializing with your fascist far right friends like Redscorpion."

    YOU, took the initiative to talk about far right, I was not specifically thinking about far right or Le Pen. Same for RS, he was talking about criminality in France, not about Le pen, but YOU took the initiative to insinuate that he voted Le Pen.

    So YOU are obsessed with Le Pen. Not me. That being said, neither me neither RS vote for LePen. It's just your personal extrapolation due to your simplistc binary vision of the world: "I'm on the right side and anybody that I can't tolerate are fascist who votes LePen".

    Ridiculous.

    Coquinou.


    Then I am blind, then my librarian is blind... and so on...
    You are so much self-centered that you can't speak about a social phenomenon without speak about yourself. Your library is not important. If you go in big library or supermarket who have the whole population as their target, like Fnac ou Auchan, you will see that.

    Either you're trolling, either you're trying to generalize French fascists ideas, and imagine they're everywhere. Then I should ask: why?
    Theses are not fascist ideas, they are republicans ideas. Share by the right as much as the left. MLP is just radicalising them in order to attracts the crowds of french who are disatisfied by the inability of the moderates party to build a world which fits with their beliefs: https://www.contrepoints.org/2011/03...e-republicaine





    Absurd and wrong.
    Just imagine a politician who'd say that we should privatize the welfare system and try to tell me that he will be popular.

    De Gaulle, who's always celebrated as a national hero, made a lot of effort to make us believe that France won the WWII, that's what most part of french believe and politicians don't take the risk to say the contrary. They prefer to talk about "la grandeur de la France" (rather the right wing) or "le modèle social français que le monde entier nous envie" (rather the left wing, but both wings actually).

    You did'nt put any argument on what i said about Hollande, the truth is that you don't have anyone.



    Absolutely not. You're forgetting neo-colonialism, which is much more important in the current French foreign policy.
    Sarkozy don't make speech to defend neo-colonialism like he make speech to defend "role that France have to play" in Libya or Afghanistan, or put the beautiful face of Rama Yade to defend neo-colonialism as he does it to defend the France's defense of the "Droits de l'Homme dont la France est la patrie et la nation". And theses are big differences. He does it easily because there's strong expectations from the french population for such kind of actions, and they are populars despite the president himself is not at all.

    Then:

    1/ Why are you talking like a fascist?
    I don't talk like a fascist. Fascist say, for example, that immigration is the cause of criminality and unemployement. I don't. I'am and I've always been a defender of free-immigration. I say the cause is socialism.

    2/ Why are you getting along along so well with fascists?
    I never get along with fascists.

    3/ Why are explaining us that they are soooo popular
    Because it's the truth.

    and that their ideas are soooo interesting?
    I never said that. You're just putting words in my mouth.

    4/ Why do you seem so obsessed with Le Pen and Joan of Arc?
    As I've ever shown to you, the only one here obssessed with Le Pen is you. And Jeanne d'Arc was in last position in my list, i did'nt feel the need to talk more about her, just observed that she's popular nowadays.


    Don't assume everybody here is a moron and can't read between the lines.
    Concerning you I don't assume it, I know it.


    Of course yes. It makes them sell.

    Demagogy is a good subject, whether it is leftist or rightist demagogy.
    Maybe. You can't say that someone is demagic based only on the level of their sale. You need more arguments.

    George Michael and Prince sells a lot too, does tat mean that they are demagogic?

    ha ha.

    Also, it can be demagogic, that would'nt invalid what I say about french's beliefs.


    Perhaps that simply means:

    1/ I know Maghrebian culture way better than French far right fascists do, and have no stupid prejudice against anybody a little bit too dark skinned for your taste.
    2/ I'm not afraid to live amongst Arabs or North Africans. As I explained months earlier, I think I have a fairly good knowledge of what is really going on within the French suburbs.


    You have no idea about how ridiculous what you say is.


    So, here's me, at a party at a girlfriend's home: http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=1#post1765091

    As you can see, I don't have prejudices or particular "distaste" for people with dark skins. I live in Cergy and the majority of people I get along with are not white. I've aso been passionate about africans and islamic cultures.

    I've been nice with you and told you to not make assumptions about me while you are not in position to do it. See the result! All you achieved to do was making you look ridiculous and like an idiot.

    3/ I do not consider immigration to be the source of all criminality in France, just like you seemed to do.
    As I said, I support free-immigration, the problem is socialism. That's why socialist like you try to minimize criminality problem, they fear they have to face the result of their politics.

    4/ I'm not the "bobo" caricature you thought I were.
    Actually, you are. Or at least, you display the chore characteristics:

    -You have the age of a bobo (25-40)
    -You consider yourself as "progressive"
    -You have a privileged social and professional position
    -You work in the tertiary sector and have a job who's "artistic" to an extent
    -You've benefit of an higher cultural background than the average
    -And also, you are cosmopolitan and pretend to know the french suburb better than thoses who truly live in.

    And:

    1/ you should be aware that the saying "next to the plate" is not necessarily understood by our non-French readers
    I know, but they easily get it when they want to get it. But you're nit-picking there, NTPs often like nit-picking, something that I remarked.

    2/ I think you're slightly younger than me, and that many people here already complained against your brash, ignorant, and immature teen-like attitude. Why? Is it an international plot specifically directed against your person? Anything else?
    No, it's just the current rationalisation of an idiot when he disagrees with someone and that he's aware to be young.

    Nothing more.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

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    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  9. #89
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    BTW Americans I listened to what you said, realized there was ample evidence from the many American perspectives to disagree with me, and realized I must be working from a broken framework. (Interestingly, another Canadian repped me as being right, so I think it might be part of how I was raised.)

    I just was overwhelmed with having a broken framework and wanted to substantively reply to I kept putting it off and now I just realized I'm never going to come back to this thread because I'm so behind on my work for this semester that I have to let it go.

    But I wanted to say that you guys have made me rethink my position, and that I was wrong!

    Cheers.

    @Beargryllz, @Metamorphosis, @Peguy, @MacGuffin, etc.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  10. #90

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    Regardless of that previous post I'm still going to chime in and say that, as an American, my experience has been that the majority of other Americans that I have met and talked to (obviously not representative of the entire population) were sadly ignorant of American history. The worst case was the argument I had with a co-worker (who had an advanced degree, by the way) over the date of the American Civil War. She insisted it happened in 1776. I finally convinced her that 1776 was the Revolutionary War and she literally asked "who were we rebelling against?" She didn't seem to believe me when I said "against the British." Likewise, when I tell the story of the British burning Washington DC in 1814, 99% of the Americans I share this with remain absolutely shocked. Most didn't even know there was a War of 1812. Not to mention the Mexican War and the Spanish-American War. I can honestly say that 90% of the Americans I have met have had absolutely no knowledge of either of these major events.

    As for Canada, I can only relate an experience of a friend of mine who now teaches in Canada. To teach effectively, he felt he needed to know Canadian history so he read 2 books on the subject. Then he started dropping references to Canadian history in his class and was shocked that people didn't know the most basic references that he read in "Canadian History for Dummies." Big ones, too, such as 1867. And he teaches at the collegiate level. This was his experience.
    Ed Womack
    Get Milked

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