User Tag List

First 1234 Last

Results 11 to 20 of 31

  1. #11
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    EsTP
    Enneagram
    6w7 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,143

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    What can I say, you're as much in need of some reading and facts as you always where and its very evident from what you've written there,
    The shits that you've read and made you think what you think, I probably read the same, or similars. So, I don't need to read, but you still need to prove your views.


    now you have succeeded in trolling me before on topics like this one, I'm not going to fall into that trap again.
    Translation: I won over Lark before, and now he knows that he can't win over me, so he does'nt want to try again.

    Its not lost on me that you singled me out and also the speed with which you responded and the same of klap trap that you responded with.
    I'm so used of socialists "ideas" and "arguing" that I don't need too much tim or too much word to break them, indeed.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  2. #12

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    The shits that you've read and made you think what you think, I probably read the same, or similars. So, I don't need to read, but you still need to prove your views.




    Translation: I rean over Lark before, and now he knows that he can't win over me, so he does'nt want to try again.



    I'm so used of socialists "ideas" and "arguing" that I don't need too much tim or too much word to break them, indeed.
    ^ Way to type.

  3. #13
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    EsTP
    Enneagram
    6w7 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,143

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    ^ Way to type.
    Edited.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  4. #14
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Enneagram
    3w4
    Posts
    6,276

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    But hasnt capitalism got something to do with the dissolution of bonds and community ties?

    The industrial revolution made everyone into individual producers or workers and markets make everyone into individual consumers or salespersons.
    I don't think capitalism is the issue, I think it has been our rapid technological innovation. Now if you want to blame capitalism for our rapid technological innovation, feel free to do so. But I think that blame would be misplaced. I think other systems would eventually have had this type of technological advancement, it just happened more quickly with capitalism.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  5. #15
    *hmmms* theadoor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    MBTI
    esfp
    Enneagram
    8w9
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    586

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed Gavroche View Post
    Capitalism has never supressed the ability for human being to love, form bonds or have feeling. If they are producers or consumers, it's only by choice. And there's far more space for romantic relationships in modern capitalist societies than in traditionals pre-capitalist societies.
    I disagree. Consumer media mostly covering the entertaining stories about extremes have lead us to believe that extremes are the new norm. In the medieval ages men fainted when women revealed their ankles. Now show me a Western man who would at least find seeing a female on the street, which by the way is a very neutral and asexual environment, in miniskirt anything special. The scale of extremes have definitely changed and as the author of the article pointed out- it still keeps stretching.
    In addition to that, I totally get the feeling that society in all aspects is trying very hard to polarize itself and there are less and less shades of grey as in matters of which part of society one can belong to. I see this radical categorization every day- at least back home in my circle people were often described as either boring (hardworking or not having any visible extremes) or wild (irresponsible, with extremes), asexual (have 0 or 1 partners) or hypersexual (change partners or have adventures every week), nice or asshole. Same with relationships- many have unrealistic expectations that relationships will either work out or won't, and such judgments are made even after the first date. If they don't, then it was clearly a mismatch, even if it works, but you don't get the butterflies in your stomach early, at least among girls of my age (very early twenties) it is often perceived that there is something wrong with such relationship. Not only that is misleading and discouraging, but also makes it way harder to meet the perfect partner, commit oneself to the relationship and stay in it for the entire lifetime.
    Oh yeah?

  6. #16
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    EsTP
    Enneagram
    6w7 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,143

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by theadoor View Post
    I disagree. Consumer media mostly covering the entertaining stories about extremes have lead us to believe that extremes are the new norm.
    That's part of the modernity. For the past, the simple fact to life until the age of 45 without being an old man was considered as an great luck, and the fact to live in relatively good health until the age of 75-80 was considered as a very rare extreme, but now theses things are considered as the norm. Also, in the 1900s it was considered as extreme to take a plane for a travel from New York to Chicago, but now it's considered as normal. Tons of things which were considered as extreme for the past are now considered as the norm. So what? It's a good thing, not an evil thing.

    In the medieval ages men fainted when women revealed their ankles.
    I've never read or heard a serious historian say that. I think there's strong chances that it's just a cliché or a legend, like thoses who say that in the medieval ages people thought that the Earth was plate.

    Now show me a Western man who would at least find seeing a female on the street, which by the way is a very neutral and asexual environment, in miniskirt anything special.
    Me. And all thoses guys who can't see a girl in miniskirt without have an hardon or pick up her. 90% of men I know are crazy and in heat when spring comes and girls start to walk in the street with bare clothes. (Lark himself, by the way, posted something about this on this board) Men tend strongly to erotize every, clothes and gestures of attractives women they see, so much so that "a very neutral and sexual environment" simply don't exist for man.

    The scale of extremes have definitely changed and as the author of the article pointed out- it still keeps stretching.

    Again, so what? If sodomy, for example, was considered as a mortal sin which send you in hell for the past, and now it's considered as a normal thing to do between people who are attracted to each other, then it's a good thing, not a wrong thing.

    In addition to that, I totally get the feeling that society in all aspects is trying very hard to polarize itself and there are less and less shades of grey as in matters of which part of society one can belong to. I see this radical categorization every day- at least back home in my circle people were often described as either boring (hardworking or not having any visible extremes) or wild (irresponsible, with extremes), asexual (have 0 or 1 partners) or hypersexual (change partners or have adventures every week), nice or asshole. Same with relationships- many have unrealistic expectations that relationships will either work out or won't, and such judgments are made even after the first date. If they don't, then it was clearly a mismatch, even if it works, but you don't get the butterflies in your stomach early, at least among girls of my age (very early twenties) it is often perceived that there is something wrong with such relationship. Not only that is misleading and discouraging, but also makes it way harder to meet the perfect partner, commit oneself to the relationship and stay in it for the entire lifetime.

    I have the same age than you and I relate a bit on what you say. But we can see misconceptions about relationships vehiculated in every societies, in something intrinsic to a society, it does'nt depend of the economic regime in vigor. I don't think that supression or limitations of economic freedoms would solve the problem.

    I noticed that, now, sodomy, for example is considered as a normal thing. At the point that if people don't do it, they are suspected to act against their impulses or to be prude etc. Maybe the previous normative system has been reversed to become a new normative system, but I think it works above all on very young people, and it is due to progressivism, not to capitalism. Anyway, it's impossible to have a society without "norms", but an opened and free society is better.
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

  7. #17

  8. #18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    I don't think capitalism is the issue, I think it has been our rapid technological innovation. Now if you want to blame capitalism for our rapid technological innovation, feel free to do so. But I think that blame would be misplaced. I think other systems would eventually have had this type of technological advancement, it just happened more quickly with capitalism.
    Its not just technology, capitalism has the chicken and egg relationship with demand and supply which makes technology affordably widely available, user friendly and individual.

    Its also got a crucial relationship with consumerism, I dont think the two are necessarily synomynous but to many people they are, including most of the people who have overthrown other sorts of economic or political or social regimes in favour of capitalism and in the minds of most libertarians or pop-capitalist rebels.

    Anyway, what is important is that the ideas at the heart of consumerism, that everyone is deserving and any demand, wish, desire should be met and can be met if the price is right, have an important relationship to pornography, or any other vice for that matter.

  9. #19

    Default

    The trouble with pornography is it's just so easy to get. It makes people socially and sexually lazy. In the past (for example), if a man was having marital troubles and his sex life was suffering, his psychosexual needs might spur him into action beyond masturbation, whether it be A) having an affair, or B) hashing things out with The Mrs.

    Pornography offers an option C in that scenario, which is shortterm gratification and avoidance of the larger problems within the relationship. Porn dilutes the need to address emotional, sexual, psychological issues that affect one-on-one intimacy and makes partnership more disposable.

    I think capitalism is guilty of aiding and abetting this social problem, but ultimately our failure to avoid the pitfalls of our technological progress is the real matter at hand.

    Note: I feel compelled to repeat that I don't think pornography is strictly 'bad.' It can be a positive tool/escape/reprieve. (The physically handicapped for instance. The husband is in the service and goes away for a long time. The girlfriend is recovering from surgery. Someone with AvPD wants to tentatively work their way up to an adult relationship. Just single, lonely, and curious. Etc.) But when someone regularly makes the choice to turn to porn rather than their significant other fifteen feet away from them, they are negatively impacting their relationship and their own quality of life by not "doing the work."
    Last edited by iwakar; 01-01-2012 at 03:54 PM. Reason: Note
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  10. #20
    Whisky Old & Women Young Speed Gavroche's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    EsTP
    Enneagram
    6w7 sx/sp
    Posts
    5,143

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Its not just technology, capitalism has the chicken and egg relationship with demand and supply which makes technology affordably widely available, user friendly and individual.

    Its also got a crucial relationship with consumerism, I dont think the two are necessarily synomynous but to many people they are, including most of the people who have overthrown other sorts of economic or political or social regimes in favour of capitalism and in the minds of most libertarians or pop-capitalist rebels.

    Anyway, what is important is that the ideas at the heart of consumerism, that everyone is deserving and any demand, wish, desire should be met and can be met if the price is right, have an important relationship to pornography, or any other vice for that matter.
    People like to masturbate and to buy stuff. That's in their nature, it's not due to capitalism. Prostitution is the oldest job of the world. It's not because people can't buy sex that they are less "lonely".
    EsTP 6w7 Sx/Sp

    Chaotic Neutral

    E=60% S=55% T=70% P=80%

    "I don't believe in guilt, I only believe in living on impulses"

    "Stereotypes about personality and gender turn out to be fairly accurate: ... On the binary Myers-Briggs measure, the thinking-feeling breakdown is about 30/70 for women versus 60/40 for men." ~ Bryan Caplan

Similar Threads

  1. Why Prayer is a SIN and affront to God
    By nozflubber in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 48
    Last Post: 03-05-2009, 11:08 AM
  2. [MBTItm] ENFPs and INFJs. Why?
    By Wyst in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 155
    Last Post: 12-08-2008, 10:32 AM
  3. [ESTP] why ESTP is rarely present, or even talked?
    By niki in forum The SP Arthouse (ESFP, ISFP, ESTP, ISTP)
    Replies: 32
    Last Post: 05-04-2008, 09:57 AM
  4. The FCC and Big Media - time is running out!
    By anii in forum Politics, History, and Current Events
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-29-2007, 01:55 AM
  5. This is why incest is against the law...
    By The Ü™ in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-14-2007, 01:46 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO