User Tag List

First 3456715 Last

Results 41 to 50 of 171

  1. #41
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    5
    Posts
    1,674

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    I think we are getting off topic here. What do you believe caused the lady's third degree burns?
    That's not off topic at all. It was a look at possible evidence that may be similar to what was provided in the court case.

    I'm only going to speculate what caused such severe burns if I could access information on how common events like this are. If third degree burns are quite common, I'd guess very frail skin and prolonged contact (due to an ineffective reaction and particular clothing material). If this is just one of a few very rare cases, then a set of unknown but highly unusual circumstances, meaning they wouldn't usually take place when an old person spills their entire fresh coffee on their lap (such as a machine malfunction, very dehydrated skin or applying pressure to the burning areas).

    Until then I just remain sceptical, which means I don't have a belief regarding what exactly made the coffee cause such severe burns.

  2. #42
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    MBTI
    INTP
    Posts
    2,739

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by erm View Post
    That's not off topic at all. It was a look at possible evidence that may be similar to what was provided in the court case.

    I'm only going to speculate what caused such severe burns if I could access information on how common events like this are. If they are quite common, I'd guess very frail skin and prolonged contact (due to an ineffective reaction and particular clothing material). If this is just one of a few very rare cases, then a set of unknown but highly unusual circumstances, meaning they wouldn't usually take place when an old person spills their entire fresh coffee on their lap (such as a machine malfunction or very dehydrated skin).

    Until then I just remain sceptical, which means I don't have a belief regarding what exactly made the coffee cause such severe burns.
    Fair enough

    I will continue to post information on scalding and third degree burns until we get to the bottom of this then

    http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/5098.html

    Most adults will suffer third-degree burns if exposed to 150 degree water for two seconds. Burns will also occur with a six-second exposure to 140 degree water or with a thirty second exposure to 130 degree water. Even if the temperature is 120 degrees, a five minute exposure could result in third-degree burns.
    Your anecdote about spilling boiling water seems somewhat inconsistent with other documented incidents. I expect this is a function of volume. I myself have often had small quantities of hot liquid touch my skin while I cook, but never large volumes like we see in American-sized beverage containers.

  3. #43
    Senior Member BAJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    ISFP
    Enneagram
    4w5
    Posts
    631

    Default

    Something I wanted to mention. I worked in different situations with acids. Once there was "detergent", and I splashed some on myself. I felt burning, so I ran to the water hose, which maybe took 5 to 10 seconds. After rinsing, I went back and looked at the back of the "detergent", and it had a huge warning label for phosphoric acid.

    The point is that my burns for this were minor, like a light scrape, but the warning label was gigantic.

    Now with coffee, you shouldn't even expect it to cause such severe burns.

    I think it's not like poking your eye out with a needle. It's more like accidentally poking your finger with a needle, expecting an ordinary prick, and looking down to see a wound the size of a quarter.

  4. #44
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    5
    Posts
    1,674

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    Fair enough

    I will continue to post information on scalding and third degree burns until we get to the bottom of this then

    http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/pubs/5098.html
    Unfortunately that appears to be the same information as the previous link, which I also found in many other articles.

  5. #45
    ThatGirl
    Guest

    Default

    Mc Donalds did not cause her to spill her coffee.


    I think her injuries do look painful, and I feel bad for her. But the fact is, she is older, and her skin is probably a lot more fragile. She is older, and probably shouldn't have been trying to balance the cup in her knees. Why didn't her son, or whoever that was, help her out? Also, the grafts are making it look worse too.

    Should McDonalds have been ordered to regulate the temperature of their coffee? Sure. And Denny's and all food establishments. Should they have been ordered to pay off her medical bills? I don't think so. Should they have for PR? Probably.

    But then who's to say people wont sue them for biting their tongue on a cheeseburger, because the cheeseburger is dangerously large. Or suing them for having a heart attack. As far as I know there is not a single person in the world, who doesn't know spilled coffee is going to burn to some extent.

  6. #46
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    MBTI
    INTP
    Posts
    2,739

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by erm View Post
    Unfortunately that appears to be the same information as the previous link, which I also found in many other articles.
    http://www.lni.wa.gov/Safety/Researc...ScaldBurns.pdf

    This one I find particularly interesting because it indicates that over 30% of burns, sustained in a kitchen restaurant environment, requiring hospitalization come from hot water. Side note: being in the hospital sucks.

    http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/e...cle/000030.htm

    So, is it truly possible for a hot liquid to cause deep tissue damage? After hearing your argument, I no longer know the answer to this question. I cannot possibly think of any way verify this information. We may never get to the bottom of this mystery.

  7. #47
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    MBTI
    INFP
    Enneagram
    5
    Posts
    1,674

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    http://www.lni.wa.gov/Safety/Researc...ScaldBurns.pdf

    This one I find particularly interesting because it indicates that over 30% of burns, sustained in a kitchen restaurant environment, requiring hospitalization come from hot water.
    Yes that is interesting. On the one hand the examples are much younger than 79, on the other hand they likely were exposed to higher temperatures and/or more liquid. The example I gave earlier, where a middle aged man spilt fryer oil on his arm, resulted in second degree burns without any grafting needed, and oil clings to the skin much more than water and is usually a higher temperature (the contact area would have been smaller than a full cup of coffee though, but the area was still quite large). Either the frailer skin from age and presumably body size, as well as a less effective response to the burning makes up for those differences, and then pushes it to third degree burns, or there was something unusual about the OP situation.

    My only guess with that chart, the info being similar to the previous link, is that it refers to very large amount of contact with the liquid, without a noticeable cooling effect. Dipping one's arm in a boiling tub of water would presumably cause deep tissue damage quickly, as the water will not lose much heat through contact with the arm, and there is a very large contact area. I'd also guess it refers to what burn would be received if treatment was lacking or delayed, and other factors akin to a possible worse case scenario. But those are just guesses trying to explain the fact the information is at odds with the examples given and my experience with heat and burns.

  8. #48
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    xkcd
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/sp
    Socionics
    INT_
    Posts
    10,733

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    People do not expect to die from overexertion during athletic competitions neither. Since statistics show that deaths do occur, is it negligent to even hold these competitions?
    Still not an accurate comparison. Some people are (rarely) susceptible to athletic exertions, there is no way without extensive medical testing to determine they will be adversely affected.

    Customers at McDonald's are an entirely different group. Not only will they have more obvious health failings, but the situation isn't the same. The hot coffee will cause serious injury to anyone that spills it in a similar situation. The same cannot be said of athletic competition.

    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    Mc Donalds did not cause her to spill her coffee.


    I think her injuries do look painful, and I feel bad for her. But the fact is, she is older, and her skin is probably a lot more fragile. She is older, and probably shouldn't have been trying to balance the cup in her knees. Why didn't her son, or whoever that was, help her out? Also, the grafts are making it look worse too.

    Should McDonalds have been ordered to regulate the temperature of their coffee? Sure. And Denny's and all food establishments. Should they have been ordered to pay off her medical bills? I don't think so. Should they have for PR? Probably.

    But then who's to say people wont sue them for biting their tongue on a cheeseburger, because the cheeseburger is dangerously large. Or suing them for having a heart attack. As far as I know there is not a single person in the world, who doesn't know spilled coffee is going to burn to some extent.
    This is all such bad reasoning.

    No, McD did not cause her to spill her coffee. But what is the expected result for doing so? 3rd degree burns? Skin grafts? That's what one should expect for spilling some coffee?

    Not saying that one can't expect some pain and suffering. To that degree? That's the whole point of the lawsuit.

    If you buy some fuel from me, should you expect it to explode and kill everyone within a 30 yard radius? Because some fuel is that volatile. Who is a fault if you are expecting gasoline and you get jet fuel?

  9. #49
    ThatGirl
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Still not an accurate comparison. Some people are (rarely) susceptible to athletic exertions, there is no way without extensive medical testing to determine they will be adversely affected.

    Customers at McDonald's are an entirely different group. Not only will they have more obvious health failings, but the situation isn't the same. The hot coffee will cause serious injury to anyone that spills it in a similar situation. The same cannot be said of athletic competition.



    This is all such bad reasoning.

    No, McD did not cause her to spill her coffee. But what is the expected result for doing so? 3rd degree burns? Skin grafts? That's what one should expect for spilling some coffee?

    Not saying that one can't expect some pain and suffering. To that degree? That's the whole point of the lawsuit.

    If you buy some fuel from me, should you expect it to explode and kill everyone within a 30 yard radius? Because some fuel is that volatile. Who is a fault if you are expecting gasoline and you get jet fuel?
    You're reasoning this wrong. If you were smoking while trying to pump gas, I would not expect you to sue me for the explosion.

    Ive burned myself on hot liquids. Point, dont spill them!

  10. #50
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    xkcd
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/sp
    Socionics
    INT_
    Posts
    10,733

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ThatGirl View Post
    You're reasoning this wrong. If you were smoking while trying to pump gas, I would not expect you to sue me for the explosion.
    Still bad reasoning. Smoking while pumping gas is not the same as ordering coffee.

Similar Threads

  1. The Random Movie Quote Thread
    By asynartetic in forum The Fluff Zone
    Replies: 220
    Last Post: 12-02-2017, 10:31 PM
  2. The Infamous INFP or INFJ Question.
    By Nørrsken in forum What's my Type?
    Replies: 44
    Last Post: 02-26-2016, 12:01 AM
  3. [JCF] The Infamous Ni-Ti Loop of INFJ
    By CuriousFeeling in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 02-24-2013, 11:50 AM
  4. The Infamous Short Post Thread
    By wolfy in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 09-27-2011, 06:58 PM
  5. The heavenly nectar that is coffee...
    By Xander in forum Home, Garden and Nature
    Replies: 104
    Last Post: 01-22-2008, 02:40 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO