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  1. #31
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    Totally. I have never met a person who isn't a hypocrite in one way or another, much less a politician.
    I think there's a major difference between hypocrisy properly so called and the inevitable contradictory nature of thinking, feeling and just life in what is, necessarily so I would suggest, an imperfect condition.

    Consistency and being devoid of any contradictions is the condition of something which can not grow, develop or change, something which is inorganic and dead. I would suggest that human beings and their social systems are characterised by growth, or potential for growth, and while you can perhaps argue about development or progress versus entropy and decay, on either an individual or collective/social systemic level, suggesting the alternative, that things should be dead is just wrong headed.

    Its part of the reason, incidentially, why I think some of the constitutionalist tendencies or really atavistic paleo-conservatives are wrong, at least in so far as they believe that humankind should seek to conform perfectly to a particular era or template and remain that way.

  2. #32
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Bigotry says you.

    Otherwise known as retaining their senses and reflecting the inevitably minority-majority relations involved in that particular political issue. Why does respect for diversity involve uniformity? Why should a minority interest itself in a minority sexual preference anyway?
    So the tyranny of the majority is acceptable to you? Let's apply this another way. If caucasians ceased to exist as the majority, then it would be fine with you that your rights be stripped from you, giving you lesser rights due to the colour of your skin, right?

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    He's biased, I'll agree to that. But who isn't? I suppose it depends on whether you like his biased-views or not, or whether you don't care one way or another about his biases. He seems to be in-the-middle enough. Moreso than many politicians...... A hypocrite? Could be, but so are all of the other politicians, and unless I'm biased and hypocritical myself, I will judge hypocrisy equally.

    I don't see him as being a liar, as much as I do other politicians. I think he is who he appears to be, moreso than most.
    I think Ron Paul is on the extreme right wing of the political spectrum, his vision predates any sort of organised societal level relief of poverty and most other aspects of modern economies or states, its not centre ground.

    Unless you think the Amish are centre ground.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    I think he is swell.

    He is the best of the lot of Republican's he is fighting against and is consistent. He is much more antiwar than Obama. He may differ on people about different things but most of it is less about how he feels about a choice to legislate and more about who has the right to legislate. (esp. state/locality rights vs. federal commerce clause which has been expanded beyond all logic for regulate morality.

    It sickens me how the corporate controlled media ignores/disrespects him but go all goo goo over the flavor of the week candidate.

    If he were to win the Republican primary, then I as an independent, would choose him over Obama in a general election in a heartbeat.
    People said the same things about Bob McClain and that other guy who ran as an independent candidate on a neither left nor right ticket a couple years back, Bob Dole?

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    So the tyranny of the majority is acceptable to you? Let's apply this another way. If caucasians ceased to exist as the majority, then it would be fine with you that your rights be stripped from you, giving you lesser rights due to the colour of your skin, right?
    I dont believe there's moral equivalence between the topic of race and sexual preference, sorry, so your allusion makes no sense what so ever.

    I dont fancy the tyranny of the majority no, I dont fancy tyranny per se, although if I had to choose I'd not pick the tyranny of the minority and for the sake of the minority and the potential backlash they will eventually face as much as for the welfare of the majority.

  6. #36
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I dont believe there's moral equivalence between the topic of race and sexual preference, sorry, so your allusion makes no sense what so ever.

    I dont fancy the tyranny of the majority no, I dont fancy tyranny per se, although if I had to choose I'd not pick the tyranny of the minority and for the sake of the minority and the potential backlash they will eventually face as much as for the welfare of the majority.
    Assumptive since what consenting adults do in their bedrooms, have nothing to do with anyone else. But this is the exact reason why religiosity within potential leaders like Ron Paul, should be exposed to sunlight. Their objective decision-making abilities have been polluted.

  7. #37
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    People said the same things about Bob McClain and that other guy who ran as an independent candidate on a neither left nor right ticket a couple years back, Bob Dole?
    Apples and Oranges

    John McCain/Bob Dole are the "moderate" Neo Cons that brought out the worst of the Republican Party as far as fiscal matters doing their part to make a horrific deficit which we in the US must now be encumbered. Where liberal Dems pushed welfare to the poor these guys were pushing for welfare for the rich.

    The tea-party schism within the GOP was of reflexion of these party elders leadership. Its only sad to see the movement which lost sight of its roots when media and corporate interests co-opted its origins and diluted/distorted it with fundamentalist Christian social Conservatives like Sarah Palin or other puppets and their minions like Glen Beck.
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Assumptive since what consenting adults do in their bedrooms, have nothing to do with anyone else. But this is the exact reason why religiosity within potential leaders like Ron Paul, should be exposed to sunlight. Their objective decision-making abilities have been polluted.
    Well I dont see the contradiction between religiosity and objectivity that you do, the objectivity of traditions is generally proven by its endurance while innovation has nothing other than novelty to recommend it.

    I'm not sure what you mean by assumptive, I didnt know that was a word I'm afraid. What adults conscent to is their own business, I dont think they have the right to try and make it other peoples business. When was the last time you heard about a sado-masochists rights movement requiring that sub-dom relationships be given statutory recognition as "marriage" with an equivalence to heterosexuality?

    And that is a proper allusion, the comparison of like with like, rather than allusions to race or other human rights struggles.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    Apples and Oranges

    John McCain/Bob Dole are the "moderate" Neo Cons that brought out the worst of the Republican Party as far as fiscal matters doing their part to make a horrific deficit which we in the US must now be encumbered. Where liberal Dems pushed welfare to the poor these guys were pushing for welfare for the rich.

    The tea-party schism within the GOP was of reflexion of these party elders leadership. Its only sad to see the movement which lost sight of its roots when media and corporate interests co-opted its origins and diluted/distorted it with fundamentalist Christian social Conservatives like Sarah Palin or other puppets and their minions like Glen Beck.
    Its funny you know, I hear right wingers rant about deficits, usually the whole attack on liberals or democrats and welfare isnt far behind but the only presidency in recent US history to manage to reduce deficit spending, stick to conservative spending targets and balance the books was Clinton.

  10. #40
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Its funny you know, I hear right wingers rant about deficits, usually the whole attack on liberals or democrats and welfare isn't far behind but the only presidency in recent US history to manage to reduce deficit spending, stick to conservative spending targets and balance the books was Clinton.
    I hardly consider myself a right winger rather I am an independent who is fiscally conservative and socially liberal for the most part. Clinton wasn't a bad Democrat as far as they go (although it would be elementary to give him all of the credit for the reduction in deficit spending [in U.S. Congress, not the executive branch, primarily controls the purse-strings] Also President Bill Clinton repealed the Glass-Steagall Act also reverbed to this day within the subprime fiasco.
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

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