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  1. #91
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    Restraining our side would help the other side win and impose their will on us.


    Yeah right.
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  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Yeah right.
    Believe what you will. Self defeating policies are are naturally self extinguishing. They will never become the law of the land for more than 1 or 2 election cycles before they get purged by a public backlash.

  3. #93
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    public backlash.
    There would never be public backlash if we weren't critical in the first place. What's your point? First you defend Obama's "pragmatic" action in this instance, saying that it's okay if the goal is to defend us from that gaggle of Islamists that are allegedly going to "impose their will on us" if we don't kill them first, and then you dismiss the dangers and criticisms (brought up by myself and others in this thread) by saying that, "well, it won't really matter because public backlash will 'naturally' prevent the policy from lasting long enough for it to turn dangerous."

    I don't get it. You seem to be going in circles.
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  4. #94
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    Still, their suit was dismissed due to the lack of merit, not because jurisdiction.
    The order indicated that the suit was dismissed as moot...the memorandum however which acted as the basis of the order also indicated that there was no jurisdiction because, amongst them, a lack of standing and involving a political question/nonjusticiable.

    The lenghty memorandum often sounds like George Orwell meets Franz Kafka meets Monty Python. And if you muster up the courage to read this horor story surly makes one happy they are not being detained at Guantanamo Bay seeking legal redress.

    See: http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal...43760/31/0.pdf
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

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    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    then you dismiss the dangers and criticisms (brought up by myself and others in this thread) by saying that, "well, it won't really matter because public backlash will 'naturally' prevent the policy from lasting long enough for it to turn dangerous."

    I don't get it. You seem to be going in circles.
    You misunderstood. I continue to assert that Obama's current stance is pragmatic, balanced and wise. The pacifist or libertarian view that some are advocating, is what I consider to be self defeating. A leader who fails to take effective action against enemies would bring misery to the population. That would cause the political pendulum to swing far in the opposite direction at the next election.

    I do not dismiss the possibility that power can be abused. I simply believe that the benefits of killing terrorists far outweigh the risk that the president will use the authority to quash all dissent.

  6. #96
    Senior Member Critical Hit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    You misunderstood. I continue to assert that Obama's current stance is pragmatic, balanced and wise. The pacifist or libertarian view that some are advocating, is what I consider to be self defeating. A leader who fails to take effective action against enemies would bring misery to the population. That would cause the political pendulum to swing far in the opposite direction at the next election.

    I do not dismiss the possibility that power can be abused. I simply believe that the benefits of killing terrorists far outweigh the risk that the president will use the authority to quash all dissent.

    HE DIDNT KILL A TERRORIST(at least on purpose). HE KILLED THE GUY WHO RUNS THE AL QAEDA NEWSLETTER. A MAN WITH NO PROVEN TIES TO ANY ACTUAL AL QAEDA OPERATIONS. A MAN WHO WAS AN AMERICAN CITIZEN.
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  7. #97
    Senior Member Critical Hit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    The other side already has that power. Restraining our side would help the other side win and impose their will on us.
    Do you honestly think the pitiful shreds of what was once Al Qaeda has any chance of "imposing its will on us"? Al Qaeda was a very loose organization to begin with, now they are a shadow of their former selves. They have almost zero operational capacity now, and even in the past their main strategy was to poke nations with sticks and hope they completely overreact and get themselves in to hopeless situations(*cough* Afghanistan).
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  8. #98
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    You misunderstood. I continue to assert that Obama's current stance is pragmatic, balanced and wise. The pacifist or libertarian view that some are advocating, is what I consider to be self defeating. A leader who fails to take effective action against enemies would bring misery to the population. That would cause the political pendulum to swing far in the opposite direction at the next election.

    I do not dismiss the possibility that power can be abused. I simply believe that the benefits of killing terrorists far outweigh the risk that the president will use the authority to quash all dissent.
    The point, though, is that power has already been abused. Obama took "effective action" against someone he and his cronies deemed to be an "enemy" without any transparency or accountability to anyone else.
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  9. #99
    Senior Member Critical Hit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    The point, though, is that power has already been abused. Obama took "effective action" against someone he and his cronies deemed to be an "enemy" without any transparency or accountability to anyone else.
    But dont you know? That guy was an evilbad terrorist! Obama totally had evidence that he was behind the underpants bomber, he just couldnt show us. Its supper sekkret evidence, its for our own good. Thank God we have such a wise and benevolent leader to protect us from all that scary information!
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  10. #100
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Critical Hit View Post
    But dont you know? That guy was an evilbad terrorist! Obama totally had evidence that he was behind the underpants bomber, he just couldnt show us. Its supper sekkret evidence, its for our own good. Thank God we have such a wise and benevolent leader to protect us from all that scary information!
    Well fuck me. I'd better just put my head down and let the better men deal with it.
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