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  1. #281
    ⒺⓉⒷ Eric B's Avatar
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    Here's another great image:

    Here's O'Reilly spouting the typical rhetoric, which shows he is just like the reporter in the picture
    http://www.billoreilly.com/site/rd?s...%3Fpid%3D34357

    Here are a couple of articles challenging whether "corporatism" is REALLY what the founders envisioned for the nation (as the conservatives assume):
    http://endoftheamericandream.com/arc...an-should-know
    http://www.addictinginfo.org/2011/07...t-corporations
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  2. #282
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    People are saying they don't know what they are protesting because if you interview and ask them, each person claims they are there for a different reason. That's where the original belief came from. The group did not seem unified under one umbrella. I don't know why that seems a strange perception to have.
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  3. #283
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    People are saying they don't know what they are protesting because if you interview and ask them, each person claims they are there for a different reason. That's where the original belief came from. The group did not seem unified under one umbrella. I don't know why that seems a strange perception to have.
    Saying that there are a plurality of issues being taken up at the protests has a distinctly different meaning than saying that "they don't know what they're protesting." The former suggests merely that there is as yet no centralized decision-making body that has subsumed all of the different issues into one unified set of concrete demands (which might not necessarily be a bad thing at this stage.) The latter suggests, especially in conjunction with photos of hippies and crazy people carrying Nazi signs, that people are just protesting to protest. Whining about nothing, if you will.

    Of course, the latter description is BS, which is what the illustration that @Eric B posted is pointing out.
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  4. #284
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Saying that there are a plurality of issues being taken up at the protests has a distinctly different meaning than saying that "they don't know what they're protesting." The former suggests merely that there is as yet no centralized decision-making body that has subsumed all of the different issues into one unified set of concrete demands (which might not necessarily be a bad thing at this stage.) The latter suggests, especially in conjunction with photos of hippies and crazy people carrying Nazi signs, that people are just protesting to protest. Whining about nothing, if you will.
    Ahh, k, I've heard it described a different way..... could be that too.
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  5. #285

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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    People are saying they don't know what they are protesting because if you interview and ask them, each person claims they are there for a different reason. That's where the original belief came from. The group did not seem unified under one umbrella. I don't know why that seems a strange perception to have.
    Would you expect any group to have complete homogenuity or a perfect consensus of opinion?

    I thought highlighting the vague and diverse opinions of the protestors was fine to begin with but now I'm beginning to believe its a deliberate attempt at dismissive reporting now.

  6. #286
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Would you expect any group to have complete homogenuity or a perfect consensus of opinion?

    I thought highlighting the vague and diverse opinions of the protestors was fine to begin with but now I'm beginning to believe its a deliberate attempt at dismissive reporting now.
    I'm not sure if I think it is dismissive reporting as much as just the way some people view the situation. Coming from people who are much more organized, it might seem that way.
    I think a lot of people probably just showed up to vent their own grievances.
    I think criticism may do them more good than harm.
    What are their goals? I think one reason why people may think "they don't know why they are protesting", is because they have no goals, either. I'll have to research it a bit tonight. I also think it may be saying that most aren't really educated on the matter.
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  7. #287

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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    I'm not sure if I think it is dismissive reporting as much as just the way some people view the situation. Coming from people who are much more organized, it might seem that way.
    I think a lot of people probably just showed up to vent their own grievances.
    I think criticism may do them more good than harm.
    What are their goals? I think one reason why people may think "they don't know why they are protesting", is because they have no goals, either. I'll have to research it a bit tonight.
    Compare it to the reporting of the Tea Party demos and protests and I suspect you'll see some difference, the vagueries and diversity of that protest movement are not used as a pretext to dismiss it as "not knowing what they want or what they are protesting about".

  8. #288
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Compare it to the reporting of the Tea Party demos and protests and I suspect you'll see some difference, the vagueries and diversity of that protest movement are not used as a pretext to dismiss it as "not knowing what they want or what they are protesting about".
    Well, maybe in their eyes, the people of the tea party knew what they were protesting about. I wouldn't assume it is a dismissal.
    Although you could be right.... in my eyes, both liberals and conservatives are guilty of pre-determinations, assuming, and slanted reporting. I think people become so involved in fighting each other that they fail to work toward the common goal of improving. Neither will give the other an ounce of regard.
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  9. #289

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    Quote Originally Posted by ICUP View Post
    Well, maybe in their eyes, the people of the tea party knew what they were protesting about. I wouldn't assume it is a dismissal.
    Although you could be right.... in my eyes, both liberals and conservatives are guilty of pre-determinations, assuming, and slanted reporting. I think people become so involved in fighting each other that they fail to work toward the common goal of improving. Neither will give the other an ounce of regard.
    Well there is the possibility that both are protest movements with more than their fair share of jokers or poor representatives who then talk to the media but the media are supposed to be professionals, instead they are opinion formers who peddle bias.

    The bias which I see in most reportage of the Tea Party is that they are extreme but its a positive good because they are exposing the marginalisation, trivialisation or disenfranchisement of politically astute members of the public.

    Which is different from the coverage of the occupy wall streeters which is a more spontaneous protest movement, I would say its about grievance at the obscene differences in wealth and consequences thrown into sharp relief by the economic crisis.

  10. #290
    Senior Member ICUP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Well there is the possibility that both are protest movements with more than their fair share of jokers or poor representatives who then talk to the media but the media are supposed to be professionals, instead they are opinion formers who peddle bias.
    This. And people irl too.

    ----------------------------

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/15/bu...pagewanted=all is telling. I think it's a different thing to dismiss the protesters, from a Wall Street executive pov. More people are angry than just the people protesting. Seems like they may be trying to keep the movement small and in-control, and of course, are defending themselves, which is actually quite disgusting from my side. I should be grateful? That's going too far.
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