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  1. #1
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Default The New Seven Deadly Sins- Courtesy of the Pope - do you agree and what is your list?

    So... for years we have had :

    Pride (Vanity) - Now there is nothing wrong with pride, but pride that gets in the way of one's belief in God or over shadows ones belief in God is what is meant here.

    Envy - An excessive jealousy of someone else's possessions, abilities, or attributes.

    Gluttony - This is basically eating too much. Eating more than your body needs to survive is considered gluttony.

    Lust - A more than healthy need to fulfill ones sexual appetites

    Anger (Wrath) - Spurn love and opt for fury.

    Greed - When the desire for wealth overrides the need for spiritualisation.

    Sloth - Those who avoid work both physically and spiritually.

    They are like old friends to some of us, I am sure...!

    Well, courtesy of the Pope, last month, we got another seven to add to the collection. All new sins that are believed to reflect the problems of the modern world. These are as follows :


    * Genetic Modification

    * Human Experimentation

    * Polluting the Environment

    * Social Injustice

    * Causing Poverty

    * Financial Gluttony

    * Taking Drugs

    So.. what do we think. Is this a good, helpful list? Would you remove or edit any? Is there any irony in the church listing financial gluttony a sin? (or is it the Pope calling the kettle black )

    What would your seven (or less... or more...) modern deadly sins be?

  2. #2
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    1. Being dishonest with yourself.
    2. Not accepting responsibility for your actions.
    3. Being hurtful to innocent others.
    4. Being wasteful of Earth's resources.
    5. Focusing too much on the superficial.
    6. Failing to live in the moment.
    7. Commercialising precious land.

  3. #3
    Lallygag Moderator Geoff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dana View Post
    1. Being dishonest with yourself.
    2. Not accepting responsibility for your actions.
    3. Being hurtful to innocent others.
    4. Being wasteful of Earth's resources.
    5. Focusing too much on the superficial.
    6. Failing to live in the moment.
    7. Commercialising precious land.
    How about a couple more for the collection :

    Unfair discrimination

    Pedophilia (Not in the original seven, I think)

    Religious persecution/extremism

  4. #4
    Senior Member Hexis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    So... for years we have had :

    Pride (Vanity) - Now there is nothing wrong with pride, but pride that gets in the way of one's belief in God or over shadows ones belief in God is what is meant here.

    Envy - An excessive jealousy of someone else's possessions, abilities, or attributes.

    Gluttony - This is basically eating too much. Eating more than your body needs to survive is considered gluttony.

    Lust - A more than healthy need to fulfill ones sexual appetites

    Anger (Wrath) - Spurn love and opt for fury.

    Greed - When the desire for wealth overrides the need for spiritualisation.

    Sloth - Those who avoid work both physically and spiritually.

    They are like old friends to some of us, I am sure...!

    Well, courtesy of the Pope, last month, we got another seven to add to the collection. All new sins that are believed to reflect the problems of the modern world. These are as follows :


    * Genetic Modification

    * Human Experimentation

    * Polluting the Environment

    * Social Injustice

    * Causing Poverty

    * Financial Gluttony

    * Taking Drugs

    So.. what do we think. Is this a good, helpful list? Would you remove or edit any? Is there any irony in the church listing financial gluttony a sin? (or is it the Pope calling the kettle black )

    What would your seven (or less... or more...) modern deadly sins be?
    All of the above, includeing the new seven (except for the one about drugs, id prefer to know for fact that I was commiting the others) have been personal favorites of mine for a long time. I dont know what I would do with out them.

    Oh and the new Pope can suck it...
    SDMF

  5. #5
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    I thought one of the new sins was supposed to be about homosexuality? Oh well. My list would be much shorter and would take the form of a single commandment.

    Thou shall not impose their religion on another.

    I think if the Catholic Church could get that one right, then the world would be far better off.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    Pedophilia (Not in the original seven, I think)
    I assume you mean child molestation, which I agree should be a condemnable sin. Pedophilia, however, is a mental disorder. We might as well add schizophrenia and anorexia to the list if you want to go that route.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  6. #6
    *ears perk up* wolfmaiden14's Avatar
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    Default No way

    There's a reason the original seven lasted so long. They are rather abstract and broader encompassing...

    Pride (Vanity)
    Genetic Modification
    Being dishonest with yourself
    Imposing your religion on another

    Envy
    Focusing too much on the superficial

    Gluttony

    Lust
    Pedophilia/child molestation

    Anger (Wrath)
    Social Injustice
    Being hurtful to innocent others
    Unfair discrimination
    Religious persecution/extremism

    Greed
    Polluting the Environment
    Causing Poverty
    Financial Gluttony
    Commercializing precious land
    Wasting Earth's resources

    Sloth
    Taking Drugs(as an escape)
    Not accepting responsibility for your actions
    Failing to live in the moment

    When it comes to the Seven sins, I also prefer to think of gluttony as ANYTHING to extravagance, which would also include some of the other things mentioned. But I guess actual etymology wins out over my opinion. lol

    So the only one mentioned thus far that I've seen as even POSSIBLY valid is

    * Human Experimentation

    And that's really a whole separate can of ethics since it's usually done in order to learn and HELP others, which may not be considered a sin, or even if so, shouldn't be a DEADLY one. Then, when the intentions are evil I'd still see the reasons for it falling under Pride, Greed, Envy or possibly Wrath.

    The Seven Sins are pretty stable. And you certainly shouldn't clutter the beauty of their ambiguity with random specifics. If anything, make new and improved commandments, like Kiddo, though I suppose that wouldn't be possible since they were directly expressed from God. But.. wouldn't the seven deadly sins have been as well? I'm not up on my lore for them.
    Forming characters! Whose? Our own or others? Both. And in that momentous fact lies the peril and responsibility of our existence. - Elihu Burritt

    Member of the Maverick's Biker Club - Now crashing through walls instead of just..walking into them.

  7. #7
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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  8. #8
    Senior Member matmos's Avatar
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    Interesting that an organization with a history of genocide in south america & torture and murder in europe (and more besides) should be advising us about modifying our behaviour.

    Whether we agree or not with the list the catholic church is becoming (or already has become) irrelevant, to the point where Ratslinger's proclamations usually end up on page 19 of the newspaper. Not the starting point of great debates.

    Edit: Anger - useful for changing your life around if you point it in the right direction; sloth - a major driver for progress; lust - how many good nights in without lust. Very few; gluttony - some people like eating and drinking too much, that's why they're fat. Do I care?; envy - where would the Joneses be without envious neighbours; greed - the economy depend on it; And Pride - the worst of the lot.

  9. #9
    Rats off to ya! Mort Belfry's Avatar
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    I've always thought the old list was a bit flawed.

    Wrath Greed Pride and Envy make sense, but Gluttony, Lust and Sloth all sound like different forms of Greed.

    Anyway here's my list:

    1 Smiling
    2 Farting
    3 Expecting others to think for you
    4 Expecting others to listen to you
    5 Pouring milk before adding the tea and sugar
    6 Having any kind of ambition that involves leaving the house
    7 Watching Two and a Half Men.

    If there was an eight, it would be, participating in the community, but that's such a given that everyone is too smart to do that nowadays.
    Why do we always come here?

    I guess we'll never know.

    It's like a kind of torture,
    To have to watch this show.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    Well, courtesy of the Pope, last month, we got another seven to add to the collection. * Genetic Modification
    * Human Experimentation
    * Polluting the Environment
    * Social Injustice
    * Causing Poverty
    * Financial Gluttony
    * Taking Drugs

    So.. what do we think. Is this a good, helpful list? Would you remove or edit any?
    Well, my first question would be if Christians are supposed to be living under grace, why is he trying to re-establish the law? But I know that's not what either of you meant...

    For the most part, (I'll get to the top two later) I think they're already covered biblically. I think it's great to remind people that some concepts mentioned long ago still have relevance. There's no verse that's says, thou shall not run up $10,000 in credit card charges but there are verses about being a wise steward of our money and possessions.

    I think the notion of causing social injustice needs to be brought up more. Particularly in America, especially with the "Christian Right" (quotations not meant out of sarcasm but nebulous definition) constant rumination of personal responsibility. It seems to translate to "You can't blame anyone else for your circumstances." What seems to be missing from the Bible's message is "your actions have consequences." I think there's too much discounting others for the sake of a adhering to political or economic ideology that goes nowhere near encompassing all the principals of the Bible.

    Without going into the why, I think certain Bible verses can either become elevated or more attention and focus is made to some. When I look at the Pope's new list, I just think Micah 6:8 says it much of it much clearer, do justice, love kindness and walk humbly w/thy God. Even though it's Old Testament text, it has a kind of New Testament application. That is, it's not just some rules to stand behind like double yellow lines, with an infraction to be melded out upon crossing, but it's a mindset to live by, whereby one's response to these words will determine a godly outcome. If you're walking in humility, you're not going to trash up the world like you're the only one in it. Doing justice motivates people to make sure others are treated equitably and not just turning a blind eye.

    I think it is necessary to point out some do's and don'ts but the purpose is not to be good so as to fit a nice label but be motivated or convicted to do good. The first leaves little room for growth or development of character. The later, of course, is much more liberating and satisfying.

    Some things I see a lot of would be greed & gluttony. In some ways I'd call them the same. I guess my beef with kinda listing these as sins is that fails to identify the root cause(s). I'm sure we've all heard the love of money is the root of all sorts of evil but greed can be brought about by two separate factors. 1st is selfishness. The whole how many yachts can you ski behind at one time thing. Over consumption with the belief one's life would be fulfilled with more money and possessions when that person is already living extremely comfortably. Sometimes we can admit what's really at the bottom of our hearts. "People will respect me more if I make more money than them! I'm gonna have the phatest crib MTV has ever seen and then won't I be popular?!"

    2nd would be fear. People can horde, greedily accumulate, not give of their resources out of fear they won't have enough. While there are certain aspects that have to do with faith on this, it also has to do with a lack of love. Perfect love casts out fear. We really haven't learned how to love. A love that causes us to sacrifice. People often say if I made more I'd give more, rarely though do they follow through. I can't remember the statistics but the per capita charitable giving in America was higher during the great depression than it was during the 80's or 90's.

    Now if anyone was within earshot, I'd prolly puff out my chest and recite the following passage dealing w/greed. Again, I'd say the emphasis should be on explaining the problem areas, maybe giving some examples as stated above, but it's a response to godly living or wanting a better world that's going to behavior that would lead away from these sins.

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