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  1. #11
    Senior Member Critical Hit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Bush was not the brightest crayon in the box, but compared to Obama, Bush is George Washington II the Great. Specifically, what has Obama done to deserve our vote in the next election?
    Once again, how have the two been anything other than superficially different?

    Remember, thousands of people didn't initially die at the hands of Bush, "the fearful president." The fact is, prior to 9/11, we had no realistic fear of the threats among us.
    And we would have continued not to have fear if the CIA didnt fuck up on a grand scale.

    Of course, fear began its natural course when Islamic militant assholes crossed the line. It was unprecedented. Americans demanded justice and preventative measures. Bush attempted to answer the call. That's his legacy.
    His legacy is invading another country based on false info/blatant lies. His legacy is detainment without trail. His legacy is torturing prisoners of war. His legacy is wiretapping.

    I dont know what call he was answering with those things but I sure as hell didnt make it.
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  2. #12
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    As objectively as this can be discussed.
    Here?

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Critical Hit View Post
    Once again, how have the two been anything other than superficially different?
    Different times. Bush led us through the aftermath of one of the worst terrorist attacks in American history.

    And we would have continued not to have fear if the CIA didnt fuck up on a grand scale.
    Guess we'll never know.

    His legacy is detainment without trial. His legacy is torturing prisoners of war.
    It wasn't in vain. Critical information was obtained from Al Qaeda leaders with that; including, the 9/11 mastermind himself (Mohammed). Necessary business.

    His legacy is wiretapping.
    Under the circumstances, I trust it was a legitimate move. (This goes along with my previous point.)

    I dont know what call he was answering with those things but I sure as hell didnt make it.
    All in all, Bush rebuilt presidential authority and kept Americans safe for over 7-years during his tenure with these actions.

  4. #14
    Intergalactic Badass mujigay's Avatar
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    It sounds like certain people are determined to like Bush or Obama and condemn thereby the other as a knee jerk reaction, not bothering to, you know, examine the evidence from a detached point of view.
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  5. #15
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    Torture is necessary in certain circumstances. (good thread topic if you ask me)

    Anyone else here ever seen Unthinkable?

  6. #16
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Here?
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by mujigay View Post
    It sounds like certain people are determined to like Bush or Obama and condemn thereby the other as a knee jerk reaction, not bothering to, you know, examine the evidence from a detached point of view.
    Thanks for pointing that out.

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Anyone else here ever seen Unthinkable?
    I have not. What is that?

  8. #18
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    I have not. What is that?
    From wikipedia:
    The film begins with an American Muslim man named Yusuf (Sheen), formerly named Younger, making a videotape.[3] When FBI Special Agent Helen Brody (Moss) and her team see news bulletins looking for Yusuf, they launch an investigation, which is curtailed when they are summoned to a high school, which has been converted into a black site under military command. They are shown Yusuf's complete tape, where he threatens to detonate three nuclear bombs in separate U.S. cities if his demands are not met.

    A special interrogator, "H" (Samuel L. Jackson), is brought in to force Yusuf to reveal the locations of the nuclear bombs. H quickly shows his capability and cruelty by chopping off one of Yusuf's fingers with a small hatchet. Horrified, Special Agent Brody attempts to put a stop to the measures. Her superiors make it clear that the potentially disastrous consequences necessitate these extreme measures. As the plot unfolds, H escalates his methods (with Brody as the "good cop") and Yusuf, trained in resisting torture, maintains his silence. Brody realizes that he allowed himself to be caught and that he is purposely enduring the torture. Yusuf then makes his demands: he would like the President of the United States to announce a cessation of support for "puppet governments" and dictatorships in Muslim countries and a withdrawal of American troops from all Muslim countries. The group immediately dismisses the possibility of his demands being met, citing the United States' declared policy of not negotiating with terrorists.

    When Brody accuses Yusuf of faking the bomb threat in order to make a point about the moral character of the United States government, he breaks down and agrees that it was all a ruse. He gives her an address to prove it, but visiting the address triggers a C-4 explosion at a nearby shopping mall, killing 53 people. Angry at the senseless deaths, Brody takes a scalpel and begins cutting Yusuf's chest. It is clear, though, that Yusuf is not afraid. He justifies the deaths by comparing them to the greater number of Muslim deaths by American hands.

    H falters in his belief that the bombs' location will be revealed until Yusuf's wife is found and detained.
    I'll leave out the rest.

    [YOUTUBE="pIpenejMR8I"]Unthinkable[/YOUTUBE]

    [YOUTUBE="IL0fdJ6JyYk"]Scene[/YOUTUBE]

  9. #19
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    Presidents are there for the time. We need presidents to keep the mood in good times. We also need presidents to keep our moods up in times of distress. We need presidents to bring us to war when it is needed. That... can be said for most presidents at least.

    Hoover was there at the height of the roaring 20's. Life was good. Keep the good times rolling! Don't bring your cynicism when your average man can be rich in an instant. That is.. until the banks started collapsing

    FDR was there for the great depression... there wasn't a clear future. Keep the nation from falling. We may not know where we will be 10-20 years from now... but keep your heads up and I'll keep mine up.

    Bush jr was there when life was good. It was lax and life wasn't so strict. Until 9/11 happened... and something had to be done. The voice was coherent, get the people who were responsible for this tragedy.

    Obama was there when that good lifestyle collapsed. When everyone and everything seems like it is collapsing one by one. Everyone is fighting everyone and everything... and there is no coherent direction in which its people want it to go. But if you stay optimistic..., we can do this.

    All in all...a president is only good in his/her time. Hoover was a good president because the roaring 20's was a good period... at least until the banks started failing. FDR was good because of the GP and World War II. Bush was good because he heeded America's call to war (yes... you people who were old enough to vote.)

  10. #20
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Obama is unfortunately not a drop of FDR.
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