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  1. #31
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    This site sure does love to hate on republicans.
    Get your party to separate fiscal and social conservatism, and you will see a lot less hatin', at least from me.

  2. #32
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    The U.S has been a corporate-run country for a long while now, that might be something most americans are blind to, but it's (as someone said) all out in the open and it is why you fight wars all the time. The rest of the world knows this fully, and we in the west are partly run by the same interests through U.S politics as well as lobbyists in our own countries (the NATO or EU countries etc).

    To be honeset, I haven't yet figured out who owns Obama, but I reckon I will. Haven't done much research... It didn't take a rocket scientist to realize the oil industry and various other interests owned Bush.
    Obama's owned by the financiers.

    Practically the entire country knows how things actually are, but no one really likes to talk about it, because of how shameful it actually is. It's tantamount to admitting that we are a failure as a society, and that things aren't going to get better or more comfortable.

  3. #33
    Senior Member knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    You kinda lost me at "pro-abortion." (Now THERE'S a Christian Coalition term for you.)

    Anyway, I thought this map was interesting:
    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/...-it-based.html

    I'm not sure that smidgens of Kansas, Montana, New Mexico, etc., will be able to turn the clock back to colonial times.

    You know how the US works: Everyone sits on their collective posteriors and doesn't give a crap about politics until it affects them, and then they get all pissy-mad and try to swing the pendulum back. Either we stay stuck and nothing changes, or we have a few heavy swings and then go back to center again.
    this is true.
    9w?

  4. #34
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burning Rave View Post
    Nope, I just hate how many of them are currently tied to Norquist.

    I can name quite a few republicans I like, that is, if you don't consider them RINOs.
    Norquist has quite a reach. There are almost zero Republicans who haven't signed his pledge that says no new taxes under any circumstances, which sounds a little like lunacy. And has always stated, even before Obama took office, his plan for when a Democrat was elected was to "make it impossible for him to govern like a Democrat." Given this man's reach, it's seems like a good argument for the "Republicans are playing hardball politics to win an election, but not to benefit the nation" rather than "Republicans are making reasonable demands and are participating as bi-partisans." That, and Obama's offer which was greater than what they originally demanded being turned down by the GOP.

    Certain interests have too strong a hold for sure. Citizens United, which has been mentioned, is huge in that. It also feels increasingly like the middle ground keep on getting dragged farther right instead of staying in a place of actual moderation (cap and trade being originally a Republican plan and now deemed devliishly liberal, the aforementioned debt ceiling deals, Obamacare resembling Romney's own pro-business plan, which is now insane liberalism, that fact that tax increaser Reagan would be labeled a RINO so hard his head would spin, etc). It feels less like an actual conversation sometimes and more like one side screaming like a child denied his Captain Crunch until the other always and inevitable gives in for a moment of respite like some weak-willed parent. In fact, the Republicans feel like Eric Cartman and the Democrats increasingly like Mrs. Cartman. It's likely tied into heavy interests influencing people on both sides. Low regulation, lower tax (especially with the current structure), low environmentalism, lower government aid to lower/middle class all seem to aid the same group (the one who can spend some money on candidates), and hurt most of the others. So they pay some people to push for these policies, and others not to fight them too hard.
    Does he want a pillow for his head?

  5. #35
    Just a statistic rhinosaur's Avatar
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    "Impossible to govern like a Democrat..." ain't that the truth. I'm curious to know exactly what role Obama played in the debt ceiling raise debacle. From what I've read it's entirely the job of Congress to manage the debt, and yet Obama came out of it with pie on his face.

  6. #36
    Senior Member jimrckhnd's Avatar
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    Well I would say EVERYBODY came out with pie on their face in this one. As disgusted as many people are with the president (and they are) the ratings for the GOP Congress is even worse. And frankly this one time the wisdom of crowds may be right. I'm not very happy with Obama on this issue for a variety of reasons but my disgust with the GOP is about an inch from seething hatred.
    Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups

  7. #37
    Just a statistic rhinosaur's Avatar
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    They're certainly not popular, but they did get most of what they wanted -- no tax increases. Too bad spending had to be cut, eh?

  8. #38
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rhinosaur View Post
    They're certainly not popular, but they did get most of what they wanted -- no tax increases. Too bad spending had to be cut, eh?
    Well the initial outcome may be what the GOP liked. The second phrase is going to get almost everyone.

    If the committee can't come up with a plan, the debt ceiling is going to be raised based on 1/2 cuts to the military and 1/2 of everything else (essentially "across-the-board cuts".) If congress won't back what the committee brings out, same thing. This is an automatic debt ceiling increase whether the committee/congress likes it or not. If they don't come up with a plan, it is their way to slight the military/the many domestic and non-defense programs that they can imagine.

    McCain choked on this.
    The liberal bloc choked on this (AND the initial phrase.)
    The tea party bloc choked on this.

    The GOP is forced to decide what is more important to them.
    Norquist, or the military.

    The democrats are forced to decide what is important to them.
    Cuts to specific programs, or cuts across all domestic/non-defense programs.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    Well I would say EVERYBODY came out with pie on their face in this one. As disgusted as many people are with the president (and they are) the ratings for the GOP Congress is even worse. And frankly this one time the wisdom of crowds may be right. I'm not very happy with Obama on this issue for a variety of reasons but my disgust with the GOP is about an inch from seething hatred.
    Quite frankly, the GOP force a debate that took about half the year for almost nothing. And for that, this thing will go on, yet again. That allotted time could of been used in many better ways. Like how a majority of Americans still see that jobs and economy is still the most important thing.

  10. #40
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    The Owners and Indentured Labour

    Instead of paying taxes your owners have the rest of you paying through debt.

    You are indentured (indebted) labour to your owners.

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