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  1. #21
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    By who?
    By people, the bane of democracy

  2. #22
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    Well my family, particularly on my mother's side, has been Republican since they were Wigs (New England Yankees). Dad was a Goldwater Republican and a CIA officer, my mother worked in an Army lab, and my brother and I are both veterans who came of age during the Carter administration.

    At various points we have all slipped away from the GOP: me first, and then one by one... now there isn't anybody in my family who seriously considers voting Republican. My father went when the GOP ran Ollie North. To parapharse the partron saint of the tea party RR - they didn't leave the Republican party, the Republican party left them when they went batshit crazy.
    It's annoying. There is practically no moderate republican out there. At the same time, the so called moderate democrats are disappearing. Someone is either too conservative or too liberal. Just being ok with taxing is too liberal. Just being ok with taxing could land you a "RINO." And now, some are even saying the Blue Dogs are "DINO" for being too conservative.

    It would be a day to see at least half of the republicans not follow Norquist.

    The irony of the situation is that the tea party is batshit crazy. In fact, they are the epitome of batshit crazy.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    My question is do Americans more than anyone else believe that their state is liable to be seized by conspirators?
    Liable to be? It's happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimrckhnd View Post
    At various points we have all slipped away from the GOP: me first, and then one by one... now there isn't anybody in my family who seriously considers voting Republican. My father went when the GOP ran Ollie North. To parapharse the partron saint of the tea party RR - they didn't leave the Republican party, the Republican party left them when they went batshit crazy.
    While the sentiment offered is true for many...including me...the notion of the Tea Party calling anyone batshit crazy is the funniest thing I've heard all week.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

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  4. #24
    Senior Member Agent Jelly's Avatar
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    If Americans didn't think we were being hijacked I doubt that Glenn Beck and the tea party would exist.

  5. #25
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    The hijacking began when the vast majority of americans ceased being citizens and became mere consumers.
    Take the weakest thing in you
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    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  6. #26
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    The U.S has been a corporate-run country for a long while now, that might be something most americans are blind to, but it's (as someone said) all out in the open and it is why you fight wars all the time. The rest of the world knows this fully, and we in the west are partly run by the same interests through U.S politics as well as lobbyists in our own countries (the NATO or EU countries etc).

    To be honeset, I haven't yet figured out who owns Obama, but I reckon I will. Haven't done much research... It didn't take a rocket scientist to realize the oil industry and various other interests owned Bush.

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  7. #27
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    To be honeset, I haven't yet figured out who owns Obama, but I reckon I will.
    "I claim not to have controlled events, but confess plainly that events have controlled me." - Abraham Lincoln

    In some ways, I can see where he is going or trying to get going.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burning Rave View Post
    It's annoying. There is practically no moderate republican out there. At the same time, the so called moderate democrats are disappearing. Someone is either too conservative or too liberal. Just being ok with taxing is too liberal. Just being ok with taxing could land you a "RINO." And now, some are even saying the Blue Dogs are "DINO" for being too conservative.

    It would be a day to see at least half of the republicans not follow Norquist.

    The irony of the situation is that the tea party is batshit crazy. In fact, they are the epitome of batshit crazy.
    They are setting the entire tone but and succeeding.

    Whatever happened to the Christian Coalition?

    I remember back when Mike Moore had just begun his TV show on the UK Channel Four network called TV Nation and published his first (and only decent) book, it made a lot of things clearer to me about the US, for instance some of the pro-abortion and other liberal issues which dont feature in UK politics and how he presented them made me understand by average people voted conservative in the US but Moore suggested, and to be honest most people in the UK believed it, that the GOP had been infiltrated by the CC and had to sing their tune.

    Now those guys are gone? Really? Chomsky wrote a bit about how he forecast the decline of CC and rise of an alternative, sounding a lot like the TP, because the ideology which was for mass consumption, and took the attention away from unemployment or inequalities, wasnt something the rich wanted to have to consume/practice themselves. Was Chomsky right on the money?

    I've got to say that I couldnt support in good conscience any of the political parties in the US, they all seem very polarised and polarising, much of the liberal agenda is completely alienating to me and the conservative agenda looks more and more like its in the grip of some insane utopian-capitalist brain fever. Seriously, it would be like the Democrats declaring they are actually going to adopt the programme of the Sparticus League or Trotskyism or something like that.

    Although, I tell you what, its popular, in the last five years I can honestly say that a lot of average Americans who I once knew who I would have considered average American conservatives have totally gravitated towards the Tea Party end of the political spectrum, a lot of them I'm not on speaking terms with anymore either, its gotten that crazy. I've heard stories, often retold proudly by the same people themselves, about how if family or friends visit and voice support for taxation or public revenue funded health services they're shown the door, I mean literally told to take a hike.

    I think its only a hop, skip and jump from that to deciding that a government employing dictatorial powers, or at least extremely authoritarian measures, to turn the clock back to colonial times is legitimate.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    The U.S has been a corporate-run country for a long while now, that might be something most americans are blind to, but it's (as someone said) all out in the open and it is why you fight wars all the time. The rest of the world knows this fully, and we in the west are partly run by the same interests through U.S politics as well as lobbyists in our own countries (the NATO or EU countries etc).

    To be honeset, I haven't yet figured out who owns Obama, but I reckon I will. Haven't done much research... It didn't take a rocket scientist to realize the oil industry and various other interests owned Bush.
    I dont know, I think there's unquestionably vested interests, there are in any state, for instance in the UK current policies (and there's a cross party consensus now) appears to indicate that so long as the speculators and bankers in The City (UK's Wall Street) are taken care of everyone else can, quite literally, die off but I dont think the government has been hijacked, no one has the balls to take these guys on and the country hasnt the wit or will for that fight.

    In the US I do think that military-keynesianism has prevailed were in the rest of the world social, health or industrial keynesianism has prevailed instead, Germany's Rhineland capitalism being one of the few examples of industrial keynesianism. Consequently the existence of a military-industrial complex is a problem, it accounts for most of graduate recruitment and most of the generation of wealth etc.

    On the other hand I remember pundits saying that part of the reason Clinton won was because the public got annoyed and Gingrich and co. being very bold about how they'd let private corporations write social and economic policy for them, a sort of "well what are we paying you guys for then?" angry reaction taking place. So in theory, or back then, the public in the US didnt like the idea of vested interests. Perhaps with the Tea Party etc. they are warming up to the idea.

    That is if it doesnt mean welfare or benefits, which seem to be the entire US zeitgheist's bug bear.

  10. #30
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I think its only a hop, skip and jump from that to deciding that a government employing dictatorial powers, or at least extremely authoritarian measures, to turn the clock back to colonial times is legitimate.
    You kinda lost me at "pro-abortion." (Now THERE'S a Christian Coalition term for you.)

    Anyway, I thought this map was interesting:
    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/...-it-based.html

    I'm not sure that smidgens of Kansas, Montana, New Mexico, etc., will be able to turn the clock back to colonial times.

    You know how the US works: Everyone sits on their collective posteriors and doesn't give a crap about politics until it affects them, and then they get all pissy-mad and try to swing the pendulum back. Either we stay stuck and nothing changes, or we have a few heavy swings and then go back to center again.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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