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Thread: Bin Laden dead

  1. #61
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frostshade View Post
    *shrugs* I'm not a parent, and I'm in no position to tell you how to raise your children.
    What exactly does this have to do with "how I raise my children?" I'm describing their response based on their personality and have let them make their own decisions and assessments of situations. Do you actually mean to insinuate that something is wrong with their response(s)?

    I can tell you that they, within their lives, see just as brutal (if not more so) crimes as that man committed. Osama bin Laden has been a bogey man for people all over the world for decades. He will not be the last by a long shot.
    No, you're right -- they see asshats every day, many of them political leaders in our own country, who might not create overt terrorist attacks, but leave people to suffer without health care or better education or equal rights within our society, and a host of other social evils. Imagine how much money was spent on finalizing this "death" and how our national budget has gone to hell in the last eight years in part because of this. There are many types of monsters in the world, and while we're rejoicing that one monster of one type is gone, we pat the others on the back. That's what my kids are up against, that's what they're already coming face to face with. And it's not an us/them thing where we can rejoice when we beat the other side, it's all damned tragic that any of that happens at all.

    I felt the same way watching the clip of Saddam's hanging. He had it coming by perpetrating a host of violences in his lifetime, but the rejoicing and glorification of yet another violent death rather than feeling like it was one more wasted life tossed into the garbage helped me realize that evil permeates all sides, even the supposed "good" side. Anyone can be tainted and become the thing they hate.

    In any case, what my intuition tells me is that children whose are directly impacted by violence -- i.e., lost a protective figure in their lives -- would respond as you said. Because it would have left them feeling very unsafe. But about 99% of the children in this country were not directly impacted by 9/11 in terms of losing an actual parent. It was a faceless, distant enemy to them.

    However, body or not. Let us all take away at least three lessons from this, 1) There are human monsters in the world 2) There are people who honestly believe in justice 3) Any and all of us can easily become either one.
    Agreed on that last one.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

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  2. #62
    Member Frostshade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    What exactly does this have to do with "how I raise my children?" I'm describing their response based on their personality and have let them make their own decisions and assessments of situations. Do you actually mean to insinuate that something is wrong with their response(s)?
    Noooooooooo. I'm saying that in case you were under the belief that I was saying that I know whats best for your children.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by sciguy90 View Post
    Is it odd that I find it extremely disappointing/uncomfortable that I'm surrounded by people celebrating death? Also how are we supposed to punish him now that he's dead?
    Death is not punishment? Celebrating justice is not odd.

  4. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    Death is not punishment? Celebrating justice is not odd.
    Oh no, now he gets to rest in peace after all that running, how terrible. True justice is making the criminal see the error of their ways, not revenge.

  5. #65
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    True. Hardly any justice with the 72 Virgins grinding on his johnson. Dammit, we fail

  6. #66
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sciguy90 View Post
    Oh no, now he gets to rest in peace after all that running, how terrible. True justice is making the criminal see the error of their ways, not revenge.
    I'm inclined to agree in general, but I don't think it was worth bothering getting him to see anything. If anything, the only justice in keeping him alive would be for him to meet his victims and their families. edit: for their sake, not his

  7. #67

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    What my point it, and what bothers me, is that people are more concerned with getting revenge rather than (civilized) justice.

  8. #68
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
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    I really don't think there is true justice that can be issued in the carnal world for people such as Bin Laden. Any means we take to administer a punishment would only fuel his hatred. His religious views and what he deems as acceptable actions (and we deem as atrocities) to take in that vein would never change. Radicalism in religion is a disease, and when manifested to the extent that is seen in people such as Bin Laden, there really is no cure. The best we can do is eradicate him and other like terrorists to eliminate some of the threat that is posed to people that don't believe/think like him (aka the "Western World" and non Islamic states).

  9. #69
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sciguy90 View Post
    What my point it, and what bothers me, is that people are more concerned with getting revenge rather than (civilized) justice.
    There is no such thing as civilized justice.

    Civilized people are just as barbaric as... well... barbarians in a different manner.

    Putting him in jail for the rest of his life can sound just as barbaric as killing him then and there and also sound just as barbaric as torturing him.

  10. #70
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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