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Thread: Bin Laden dead

  1. #101
    Senior Member Stigmata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    For a second there, I thought you were being hippy-ish, but now it just sounds like you're apathetic and cynical.
    Correct on the apathy, yet I'm not trying to intentionally be cynical. My indifference to it all just tends to attempt to analyze the overall situation, rather than fixating on smaller details that should appeal to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    I wouldn't take that too far, but that's what the message is at least. Is it better? Of course it is. I don't think everyone is equally right. The West isn't just different. It's better. Not great either. Just better. Perhaps one day they'll all be sitting on their fat asses munching on hot dogs and watching reruns of Friends --- and the world will be better off for it. Seriously.

  2. #102
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    I don't think the West is "just better" but you see, Stigmata, what we do have in our favor is SCIENCE. The problem with these fundamentalist, extremist religious groups in the Middle East is that their civilizations reject ...progress. That's a problem, and they've had these problems for fucking centuries.

    While I'm not going to say Western culture is better than Eastern culture (I happen to be a fan of some of the aspects of Eastern Europe as well as far East Asia, but not so much the Central Asian Islamic cultures, out of personal preference) BUT I will say that democracy and science are better than intentional, oppressive ignorance, um, yeah.

  3. #103
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    I don't get this logic that things are gonna be super-terroristy now that Osama's dead. What, was Al Qaeda just kinda irked before, and now they're pissed? Now Death to America is gonna become, like, OMG, SOOOOO much more death to America. How many people were into bin Laden enough to start being terrorists when he dies, but not enough to join his stated cause when he's alive? And what's the alternative? Shit, this guy has some kind of following and deliberately attacked a number of countries. But, we have to not do anything, cause if we retaliate, it's just gonna get worse. Shit, guess we made the wrong call arresting Charles Manson. That Hitler backlash really came back to bite us in the ass too.
    Does he want a pillow for his head?

  4. #104
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stigmata View Post
    Yeah, yeah.. hot dogs aren't very enticing.

    Perhaps we'll just follow this guy's advice.


  5. #105
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stigmata View Post
    Correct on the apathy, yet I'm not trying to intentionally be cynical. My indifference to it all just tends to attempt to analyze the overall situation, rather than fixating on smaller details that should appeal to me.
    Let's look at this from another perspective. Do you suppose bin Laden would have allowed himself to be taken alive? Or do you believe the U.S. should have just forgotten about him and allowed him to live a long and prosperous life?

  6. #106
    Probably Most Brilliant Craft's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Whatever terrorism means? I'll help you. Terrorism is random acts of violence committed to inspire fear by targeting civilians (rather than military troops or political leaders) to further ideological goals, which are committed by people not affiliated with a particular government.
    There is more to it than that. There's history. Flawed Ideologies can originate from past mistakes. Terrorism, if viewed from the perspective of the oppressed, could be an act of retribution. Terrorism could be a reaction towards the "bullying" of a set of demography.

    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Are you referring to here specifically? I don't see that much bloodlust here. I'm sure there's a fair share of it elsewhere though.

    If you mean here, then I think your dramaticism is worrying. Expressing some satisfication that Osama Bin Laden is in the past is not popularity of hostility. It'd be different if we were talking about baby Jessica.
    I'm talking everywhere, primarily amongst U.S. citizens. From a foreigner's perspective, it all seems so awkward and weird. Death is death. There's a bigger problem to solve: the popularization of death.

  7. #107
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craft View Post
    I'm talking everywhere, primarily amongst U.S. citizens. From a foreigner's perspective, it all seems so awkward and weird. Death is death. There's a bigger problem to solve: the popularization of death.
    Somewhat speculative. The US has more bloodlust than some other nations, and more than I am generally okay with (I have death penalty issues), but bin Laden's death involved a firefight, not an execution. I'm not sure the reaction would be so different if he were captured.
    Does he want a pillow for his head?

  8. #108
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Porrrrrn in the USA!

    Sorry, I'm drunk.

  9. #109
    Senior Member Stigmata's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    I don't think the West is "just better" but you see, Stigmata, what we do have in our favor is SCIENCE. The problem with these fundamentalist, extremist religious groups in the Middle East is that their civilizations reject ...progress. That's a problem, and they've had these problems for fucking centuries.

    While I'm not going to say Western culture is better than Eastern culture (I happen to be a fan of some of the aspects of Eastern Europe as well as far East Asia, but not so much the Central Asian Islamic cultures, out of personal preference) BUT I will say that democracy and science are better than intentional, oppressive ignorance, um, yeah.
    What does science have to do with conflicting religious and cultural views? This isn't a technological war, nor is it primarily over resources, as only one side(Us) really stand from a realistic position to benefit. It's one thing to have national/cultural pride, yet it's something completely different when you begin spread your views and outlook around as the objective moral standard for which everyone must abide by. It's condescending suggest that various cultural differences equates to some type of stagnation of social evolution on their part.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Let's look at this from another perspective. Do you suppose bin Laden would have allowed himself to be taken alive? Or do you believe the U.S. should have just forgotten about him and allowed him to live a long and prosperous life?
    In a very simplistic and hollow sense, yes we accomplished a goal. Yet even then, do we allow ourselves to become content with this, or do we beg to ask some of the unpopular questions that require us to dig further beneath the surface?

    Quote Originally Posted by Craft View Post
    I'm talking everywhere, primarily amongst U.S. citizens. From a foreigner's perspective, it all seems so awkward and weird. Death is death. There's a bigger problem to solve: the popularization of death.
    Totally agree with this, yet it's just more apparent to me how much context and circumstance matters. Morality is a elastic concept which people will willingly bend to favor that which best aligns with their own ideals.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Craft View Post
    There is more to it than that. There's history. Flawed Ideologies can originate from past mistakes. Terrorism, if viewed from the perspective of the oppressed, could be an act of retribution. Terrorism could be a reaction towards the "bullying" of a set of demography.
    Or it could just be the meglomaniacal agenda of a brainwashed, sexually repressed invidual who srsly believes they'll be rewarded with 70 virgins in heaven.

    I really fucking hate their beliefs. 70 virgins. The basic tenants of their religion reduce females to mere objects to be obtained, not human beings of their own merit.

    Anyway, no one is rejoicing over the deaths of innocent God-fearing Muslims here, they're relieved that an extremist, murderous cult leader is dead.

    I'll be happy if Ghaddafi dies too, and I'd be equally as happy if the oppressor in question were a Christian like Hitler.

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