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  1. #121
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Lets ask Frank


  2. #122
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    For murderers.
    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    This would only apply for the murder of "innocent" people.
    I'm curious as to what the difference is between murderers and murderers of innocent people?
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  3. #123
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    Probably the difference between killing a member of an enemy gang, and killing some random person just because you could.

  4. #124
    Senior Member Perch420's Avatar
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    If you're arguing against the death penalty on the basis of the small possibility that the person in question can go on to do good things, why aren't you also arguing against jail? After all, a serial rapists could become a genius mathematician if he wasn't put in prison.
    “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” - G. K. Chesterton

  5. #125
    Senior Member Perch420's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fan.of.Devin View Post
    Vengeance is a primitive, savage, and stupid (albeit, very human) desire that has no place in the justice system of any civilized society... Killing people when it's not absolutely needed isn't good and doesn't solve problems.

    I have genuinely never seen a convincing case for capital punishment, ethically or economically.
    If you are in favor of it to spite offenders, you have issues, quite frankly.
    If you are in favor of it because you think it's practical, I think that you're misguided, and excluding that, I would like to suggest that the ends still don't justify the means.

    The only ethically defensible time to kill a person is if/when they pose an immediate and serious threat to another's life and limb; failing that, they belong behind bars, in rehabilitation, or both.
    For the tenth damn time, this isn't about vengeance; it's a matter of utility. Why should society keep alive a person who is a danger to that same society?
    “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” - G. K. Chesterton

  6. #126
    Senior Member Perch420's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    I remember times in a country when they said, killing all the retarded people would save billion of lifes, cause it would free the human gene code from these deseases forever. Story of my life, "From Pragmatism to Ausschwitz", today Poland and the day after tomorrow the whole World !!
    Why kill the mentally retarded? Sterilization would accomplish the stated goal equally as well.
    “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” - G. K. Chesterton

  7. #127
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Perch420 View Post
    For the tenth damn time, this isn't about vengeance; it's a matter of utility. Why should society keep alive a person who is a danger to that same society?
    Vengence or revenge are legitimate in my opinion, why wouldnt they be? Because the lawful are expected to play to their own standards when no one else is?

  8. #128
    Senior Member Perch420's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    I'm against death penalty.

    I would replace it with life in prison without parole, or any kind of visits, letters, or any contact. No books, no going out in the yard, no nothing. For murderers. Because it's worse than dying.

    And there's the more sadistic option of a death penalty after spending most of their lives in prison.

    This would only apply for the murder of "innocent" people.
    Why? Murderers didn't "choose" to be murderers. The world made them as such. People don't have free will; we live in a deterministic and linear universe.
    “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” - G. K. Chesterton

  9. #129
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Perch420 View Post
    Why kill the mentally retarded? Sterilization would accomplish the stated goal equally as well.
    That's fine if the sorts of mental disease are hereditary and definitely going to be transfered to the next generation, what about birth defects or disability which are not easily predicted? I'm not sure that its not going to reduce at a stroke that population of people who you'd like to keep the numbers reduced, contained or disappearing.

  10. #130
    Senior Member Perch420's Avatar
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    Well, I guess we can't do anything about those birth defects or disabilities then. What's your point?
    “Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.” - G. K. Chesterton

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