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  1. #1
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    Default Convicted Felons Should Not Be Second Class Citizens

    We all know that once you get out of prison for your crimes that life is going to and will be a difficult piece of shit. Being released with little means to support oneselve is one thing, but a major problem is that society will basically stigmatize you for your life. Business will deny you jobs, you can't vote, etc.

    But why should it be this way?

    Those who have gone to prison have served their sentence and have taken their punishment. They shouldn't have to be treated like scum once they are released, nor should business be allowed to deny them jobs because of it.

    (And on a related note: if an felon who has been released from prison can't find a job becuase of his stigma as a felon, then the chances that he will turn to crime to keep himself alive is very likely).

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    Another awesome member. Curator's Avatar
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    I agree with you on some counts... but really for me it depends a lot on what their felony offense was... I think that is a really important distinction, somebody with a bunch of pot gets arrested...felon... somebody repeatedly rapes and beats multiple people -felon... I believe some sort of rules where a person only has to admit to felonies on applications if they meet certain criteria (such as being violent) then the rest with more minor offenses, that are still considered felonies, but should in no way effect their ability to do a job, do not have to state anything about it on the application, and make it illegal for them to require to do so UNLESS its applicable, such as Drug felonies for somebody applying to be a an assistant at a pharmacy or something...
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    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage Idealist View Post
    We all know that once you get out of prison for your crimes that life is going to and will be a difficult piece of shit. Being released with little means to support oneselve is one thing, but a major problem is that society will basically stigmatize you for your life. Business will deny you jobs, you can't vote, etc.

    But why should it be this way?

    Those who have gone to prison have served their sentence and have taken their punishment. They shouldn't have to be treated like scum once they are released, nor should business be allowed to deny them jobs because of it.

    (And on a related note: if an felon who has been released from prison can't find a job becuase of his stigma as a felon, then the chances that he will turn to crime to keep himself alive is very likely).
    I agree entirely, but with the caveat that I also support far harsher punishment for most mala in se crimes than mere imprisonment.
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    Wouldn't it just be easier to pretend that we've rehabilitated them? Just look at that word, "rehabilitate". Does it not evoke a sense of helping, a bit of goodwill towards our fellow brethren? Sometimes i worry that our help is going unappreciated. We shouldn't have to be so critical of ourselves or of our society, because we really do care about these people. It is good to care about others.

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    Only on some counts.

    What does "serving their sentence and have taken their punishment" mean to you? Staying in prison for the allotted time that the judge or jury decides on?

    What does it say about the system when a rapist and an animal killer both get convicted of their crime, but the animal killer gets to stay in jail twice as long as the convicted rapist?

    Does that really speak of the convicted rapist as serving his/her sentence? Yes. Does it mean that he/she has taken their punishment? No, and the punishment tends to be personal/subjective.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Takeru View Post
    Only on some counts.

    What does "serving their sentence and have taken their punishment" mean to you? Staying in prison for the allotted time that the judge or jury decides on?

    What does it say about the system when a rapist and an animal killer both get convicted of their crime, but the animal killer gets to stay in jail twice as long as the convicted rapist?

    Does that really speak of the convicted rapist as serving his/her sentence? Yes. Does it mean that he/she has taken their punishment? No, and the punishment tends to be personal/subjective.
    Great points! I agree entirely.
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    Originally posted by Curator
    I agree with you on some counts... but really for me it depends a lot on what their felony offense was... I think that is a really important distinction, somebody with a bunch of pot gets arrested...felon... somebody repeatedly rapes and beats multiple people -felon... I believe some sort of rules where a person only has to admit to felonies on applications if they meet certain criteria (such as being violent) then the rest with more minor offenses, that are still considered felonies, but should in no way effect their ability to do a job, do not have to state anything about it on the application, and make it illegal for them to require to do so UNLESS its applicable, such as Drug felonies for somebody applying to be a an assistant at a pharmacy or something...
    But even if their felony was a harsh and or brutal crime, wouldn't it be unfair to eternally judge them for that? Why's a convicted drug dealer unable to work a pharmcay if he has tekn his punishment and become a productive member of society? Espcially considering that he could be a good candidte for the job if he has the knowledge.

    Originally posted by Aleksei
    I agree entirely, but with the caveat that I also support far harsher punishment for most mala in se crimes than mere imprisonment.
    What's a mala in se crime exactly?

    Originally posted by Beargryllz
    Wouldn't it just be easier to pretend that we've rehabilitated them? Just look at that word, "rehabilitate". Does it not evoke a sense of helping, a bit of goodwill towards our fellow brethren? Sometimes i worry that our help is going unappreciated. We shouldn't have to be so critical of ourselves or of our society, because we really do care about these people. It is good to care about others.
    If society is so caring then why do most people out of prison live in a stigmatized second class? I fbusinessnes cared about other they wouldn't bother to ask for criminal background checks.

    Originally posted by Takeru
    Only on some counts.

    What does "serving their sentence and have taken their punishment" mean to you? Staying in prison for the allotted time that the judge or jury decides on?

    What does it say about the system when a rapist and an animal killer both get convicted of their crime, but the animal killer gets to stay in jail twice as long as the convicted rapist?
    Serving their punishment means they go to jail for X years. Why should they be subject to anything more? And if a rapist is getting less time than someone who kills an animal then the system is clearly broken.

    Does that really speak of the convicted rapist as serving his/her sentence? Yes. Does it mean that he/she has taken their punishment? No, and the punishment tends to be personal/subjective.[/QUOTE]

    Uh, you do know the danger of allowing punishment to lay indirectly in the hands of people who base thier desicions purely on subjectivity right? Should people really be punished for their entire lives for such things?

  8. #8
    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage Idealist View Post
    What's a mala in se crime exactly?
    Latin, "bad in itself." Violent crime, and such.
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    Originally posted by Aleksei
    Latin, "bad in itself." Violent crime, and such.
    Oh you mean shit like mugging, unjustified assult and murder, rape, and the such?

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    Yeah, I can fly. Aleksei's Avatar
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    Yeah
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