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  1. #31
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Why has this forum turned into IgnoranceCentral recently?
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  2. #32
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangey View Post
    Why has this forum turned into IgnoranceCentral recently?
    People should know better than to introduce the topic of intelligence vs. race. There's nothing of value to be gained in the discussion. There will be opinions aired that agree with modern orthodoxy and there will be opinions aired that disagree with modern orthodoxy, but in either case the opinions will be held because of their relationship to modern orthodoxy... not anything useful or factual or even kind.

    So I agree. Let's bag the topic. I move that a mod Graveyard the thread.

  3. #33
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
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    This is a fantastic discussion Perch420, and I'm glad you posted it. Some people will say that discussing something like this is "dangerous" or "taboo".. I find the lack of open discussion FAR more dangerous, and genuninely hope someone is open enough to discuss WHY IQ does or doesn't correlate to intelligence, instead of why you shouldn't pose this question.

    I pride myself on being a thought criminal.

    The assumption that you have posted this question in pursuit of further "evidence" to support your own theory is besides the point. I do hope *and assume* that you are far past some element of racial degredation, but your intent has nothing to do with the truth of the matter, does it?

    My guess, is that you'll find studies linking IQ to inherited genes, linking to race, obviously... and that you'll also find studies that claim there is little if any genetic componenet. THe studies I looked at shows a much higher difference in IQ through nurture elements, things like if your parents graduated college. I am specifcally referring to IQ here because the general consensus is that intelligence really can't be measured.. and IQ is one of the closer but still not very good tools to use. I mean, you've got linguistic intelligence, logical-mathematic intelligence, musical intelligence, spatial intelligence, bodily kinesthetic intelligence, inter personal intelligence, intra personal intlligence, natrualistic intelligence, and existential intelligence. And this is only what a few lowly humans came up with.. I bet there is more.

    The other problem is that I don't think that many studies on race & IQ are publically available. It almost seems like a useless avenue. Society WANTS to believe all people are equal. So even if you find legitimate evidence that disproves this.. is it going to be welcomed? No. The race card will be waived or some thought police will find it highly innapropriate. We are such humanitarians. We love our fellow man so much that we refuse to accept that race & intelligence a possibility, in fear of what might become of this. We love our fellow man so much that we assume his agenda is always dark and that he can not be trusted with the truth.
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  4. #34
    morose bourgeoisie
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    I will indeed shut up then, and leave you to your absurd premise.
    Sigh...

  5. #35
    Senior Member Santosha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chachamaru View Post
    I inhale stupidity and exhale awesome.

    And also piss glitter. And period silk.

    Everything hurts.

    I am from the South too. Perhaps I'm a mutant?
    That is fantastic right there, just fantastic =)
    Man suffers only because he takes seriously what the gods made for fun - Watts

  6. #36
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    Some people will say that discussing something like this is "dangerous" or "taboo".. I find the lack of open discussion FAR more dangerous, and genuninely hope someone is open enough to discuss WHY IQ does or doesn't correlate to intelligence, instead of why you shouldn't pose this question.
    This also deserves special emphasis.

  7. #37
    Sniffles
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    Top 10 things you should never discuss online.

    I believe this would fall under #7.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    10 ways to display cowardice

  9. #39
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Huxley3112 View Post
    The other problem is that I don't think that many studies on race & IQ are publically available. It almost seems like a useless avenue. Society WANTS to believe all people are equal. So even if you find legitimate evidence that disproves this.. is it going to be welcomed? No. The race card will be waived or some thought police will find it highly innapropriate. We are such humanitarians. We love our fellow man so much that we refuse to accept that race & intelligence a possibility, in fear of what might become of this. We love our fellow man so much that we assume his agenda is always dark and that he can not be trusted with the truth.
    So you're saying people are afraid of the potential "truth" that some races might be inherently less intelligent than others? Even the thought that this could potentially be true is RACISM, pure and simple. Such an hypothesis, in fact, could only be formed in the context of a society in which racism existed. So yes, let's all be brave and delve into racist hypotheses under the belief that "it could possibly be true." No one's ever done that before. :rolleyes2:
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  10. #40
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    "African American IQ scores have long averaged about 15 points below those of Whites, with correspondingly lower scores on academic achievement tests. In recent years the achievement-test gap has narrowed appreciably. It is possible that the IQ-score differential is narrowing as well, but this has not been clearly established. The cause of that differential is not known; it is apparently not due to any simple form of bias in the content or administration of the tests themselves. The Flynn effect shows that environmental factors can produce differences of at least this magnitude, but that effect is mysterious in its own right. Several culturally-based explanations of the Black/White IQ differential have been proposed; some are plausible, but so far none has been conclusively supported. There is even less empirical support for a genetic interpretation. In short, no adequate explanation of the differential between the IQ means of Blacks and Whites is presently available."
    http://internal.psychology.illinois....telligence.pdf

    So much for the American Psychological Association.

    But what do they know?! Let the mud-wrestling begin. After all, not discussing a politically delicate but ultimately scientific question that there is no scientific consensus about and about which very few forum members will have solid factual knowledge on the internet with people you don't know would be tantamount to censorship and oppression. We don't want that now, do we?
    The good life is one inspired by love and guided by knowledge. Neither love without knowledge, nor knowledge without love can produce a good life. - Bertrand Russell
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