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  1. #51
    Senior Member Moonflower's Avatar
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    If anyone thinks that traditional marriage is good marriage, here are some things you may be forgetting about traditional marriage:
    1. Marriage was once for the purpose of property and money only. No love, just a business deal.
    2. A 14-year-old girl marrying a 40-year-old-man was a-okay.
    3. Children were born to work, and quantity was more important than quality.
    4. It was legal and perfectly acceptable for a man to abuse a disobedient wife.
    5. Men also had the right to get sex whenever he pleased, thus making rape within a marriage never actually considered "rape".
    6. Interracial marriage and marriage between people of different religions was illegal and taboo.
    If one says that allowing gay people to marry is something they are against due to violation of tradition, I hope they consider the things above part of this tradition and are working to make those traditions acceptable again. Otherwise, they are being a tad hypocritical.

  2. #52
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torai View Post
    I'm curious. Does that go for people who use condoms to keep from spreading venereal diseases?
    Well in that case, they're deliberately interferring with the natural act - so in essence they're engaging in mutual masturbation.

  3. #53
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by guesswho View Post
    How can it be the same thing?
    If you're going to use the argument that "children will feel different ...", then similar scenarios where the children felt different are admissible as parallel cases. Maybe if you had taken a different approach, they would not be relevant.

    I shouldn't have said anything in this thread...since I live in a place where being gay is virtually banned.
    I can't tell you whether or not you should have said anything in this thread.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #54
    Member Torai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moonflower View Post
    If anyone thinks that traditional marriage is good marriage, here are some things you may be forgetting about traditional marriage:
    1. Marriage was once for the purpose of property and money only. No love, just a business deal.
    2. A 14-year-old girl marrying a 40-year-old-man was a-okay.
    3. Children were born to work, and quantity was more important than quality.
    4. It was legal and perfectly acceptable for a man to abuse a disobedient wife.
    5. Men also had the right to get sex whenever he pleased, thus making rape within a marriage never actually considered "rape".
    6. Interracial marriage and marriage between people of different religions was illegal and taboo.
    If one says that allowing gay people to marry is something they are against due to violation of tradition, I hope they consider the things above part of this tradition and are working to make those traditions acceptable again. Otherwise, they are being a tad hypocritical.
    A 40-year old man marrying many 14-year old girls was okay. XD

    And besides, the guy was making a point that I said something hypocritical.

  5. #55
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Personally, I've never had anything against polygyny or polyandry.

  6. #56
    Sniffles
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moonflower View Post
    If anyone thinks that traditional marriage is good marriage, here are some things you may be forgetting about traditional marriage:
    1. Marriage was once for the purpose of property and money only. No love, just a business deal.
    2. A 14-year-old girl marrying a 40-year-old-man was a-okay.
    3. Children were born to work, and quantity was more important than quality.
    4. It was legal and perfectly acceptable for a man to abuse a disobedient wife.
    5. Men also had the right to get sex whenever he pleased, thus making rape within a marriage never actually considered "rape".
    6. Interracial marriage and marriage between people of different religions was illegal and taboo.
    If one says that allowing gay people to marry is something they are against due to violation of tradition, I hope they consider the things above part of this tradition and are working to make those traditions acceptable again. Otherwise, they are being a tad hypocritical.
    Has anybody here actually made an argument in favor of those things? If not, why would defenders of traditional marriage be obligated to defend those things, or else they'd be hypocrites? Why are any of those things you mentioned necessarily bad in the first place?

  7. #57
    Member Torai's Avatar
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    Wait, you're open-minded about polygamy, but not gay marriage? That's messed up to me...

    Explain.

    Also, I'm open-minded about polygamy, I just assume other people aren't.


    Also, how many people are laughing their ass off reading this thread? Am I alone?

  8. #58
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arclight View Post
    OK First point.. There seems to be a pattern emerging here , where members of this site who have BLUE names seem to feel they are qualified to assess my emotional status..
    Oh wow. Are you really going there?
    You're kind of just proving my point.

    SO I am going to explain to you.. and hopefully you will pass it on to your buddies.. I AM BLUNT, I AM BLUNT, I AM BLUNT, I AM BLUNT.
    I am not angry, I am not hostile, I am not bitter, I am often sad and usually pretty neutral. But I AM BLUNT..
    Why on earth are you using all caps in your response?
    I'm glad you're not angry, or I might perceive that you are yelling at me.

    EDIT: Buddies? What are you talking about?

    IN real life, people can't tell how I feel 90% of the time unless I make it obvious.. SO I am pretty fed up with some people who don't even know me, telling me how I am feeling on the interwebz. I am BLUNT, and usually right. and it makes you feel hostility, or bitterness, or anger and you just end up projecting your feelings on to the messenger. OK I don't know that.. But see how freaking annoying it is to have some person who barely knows anything about you, psychoanalyzing you and passing judgments??..
    Whatever. I'll wait for you to get done here and move on to the topic.

    I already mentioned This is what the issue is in a society where gay marriage is legal. Maybe if you stopped reacting emotionally to certain words and actually read the whole body and not just focused on what upset you so much. You would know .. That I live in a society where gay marriage is legal.
    Still waiting.

    My argument comes from the fact that Gays feel their sexually constitutes a CULTURE.
    If this is true. Then ALL sexualities are a culture.. Then my argument is a simple one. What right does one culture have to impose itself on another?
    Culturally speaking.. Marriage is embedded in the culture heterosexuality.
    The gays say that they were fighting for legal status.. They got it.. There fight is over.. So why are they still demanding to be "special" ??
    Maybe they are then.. But then that would make heteros special as well. Which means Maybe they should be allowed to have something unique to their culture as well.
    Fine. I will concede that, since in your culture, gays can legally be married, your framework is different from mine.
    In my culture, they cannot be legally married, so when I hear this comment, it typically is just people blowing steam out their ass.

    I'm not sure what you mean by "special." I see a lot of groups "pride" parades, from racial, religious, and cultural perspectives. I mean, do you celebrate Christmas? Do you have a black history month where you are? You're bitching about gay pride parades; big deal, unless you want to remove all other pride parades as well. I can't help but feel like you are singling gay pride out more, for whatever reason.

    Where Do I express hostility?
    Oh dear. Are you really asking me that?

    SO either gays are welcomed as equal members of this society . Or they keep their "special" status.
    I think you need to specify what you mean by "equal." Is there still discrimination on different levels with gays in your culture? I have no idea.

    I mean, just because blacks can marry (for example) doesn't mean they still might not need some anti-discrimination laws to protect their rights in other areas until a particular culture catches up.

    You are seeming to equal marriage equality with full social equality, which might or might not be accurate. Check on that one.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  9. #59
    Member Torai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    Why on earth are you using all caps in your response?
    BECAUSE ALL-CAPS IS CRUISE CONTROL FOR COOL!

  10. #60
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torai View Post
    Wait, you're open-minded about polygamy, but not gay marriage? That's messed up to me...

    Explain.

    Also, I'm open-minded about polygamy, I just assume other people aren't.


    Also, how many people are laughing their ass off reading this thread? Am I alone?
    I don't think anyone in this thread is opposed to gay marriage, though I will admit I do tend to skim these threads, so if you find someone, be sure to let me know.

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