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  1. #1
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Default Philadelphia Abortion Doctor Charged With Murder

    http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE70I71G20110119

    Prosecutors charged a Philadelphia abortion doctor with murder on Wednesday, claiming he killed viable babies by cutting their spinal cords with scissors after removing them from mothers late in their pregnancies.

    Philadelphia District Attorney Seth Williams charged Dr. Kermit Gosnell and nine associates with seven counts of murder involving babies, but said hundreds of others likely died in the squalid clinic that Gosnell ran from 1979 to 2010.

    The defendants face first-degree murder in the cases of seven babies for which there is substantial evidence, Williams said. The babies were born alive and viable, he said.

    "My comprehension of the English language can't adequately describe the barbaric nature of Dr. Gosnell," Williams said at a news conference.

    Williams said he may seek the death penalty for Gosnell, 69, who with his associates was arrested on Wednesday.

    ...

    "A doctor who cuts into the necks severing the spinal cords of living, breathing babies, who would survive with proper medical attention, is committing murder under the law," he said.

    Women who came to the clinic were given medication to induce delivery, and the viable babies were killed by Gosnell and his associates, Williams said.

    He said Gosnell's clients, many of whom were poor, were charged $325 for a first-trimester abortion and between $1,625 and $3,000 for an illegal abortion after 24 weeks.

    Gosnell also faces a charge of third-degree murder, stemming from the death of a mother who died from an overdose of anesthetics, he said.

    The charges follow a year-long investigation by a grand jury, whose report was unveiled on Wednesday.
    The report read, in part: "Although no one could place an exact number on the instances, Gosnell's staff testified that killing large, late-term babies who had been observed breathing and moving was a regular occurrence."

    Prosecutors said the state Health Department was informed of violations at Gosnell's clinic as early as 1996 but failed to respond and did not visit the clinic until February 2010 when it was raided during a drug investigation.
    ...
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  2. #2
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Wow, that's definitely crossing the line.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  3. #3
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Sometimes, words just seem inadequate; the most 'interesting' thing about this case is that the authorities apparently failed to take action on the basis of this crime for fourteen years, and only did so now on the basis of a drug investigation. That calls for an investigation itself, and makes me wonder how common illegal late-term abortions of viable fetuses are at other abortion clinics in an atmosphere of virtual impunity?

  4. #4
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    I read the story this morning on the train, pretty sick stuff.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    Sometimes, words just seem inadequate; the most 'interesting' thing about this case is that the authorities apparently failed to take action on the basis of this crime for fourteen years, and only did so now on the basis of a drug investigation. That calls for an investigation itself, and makes me wonder how common illegal late-term abortions of viable fetuses are at other abortion clinics in an atmosphere of virtual impunity?
    I hope that's not a common occurrence, but pro-lifers will try to claim it is, regardless of whether or not there is any evidence.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #6
    Senior Member Rex's Avatar
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    Sick fuck.. I hope there is a hell. He any hes minions goes there if so.

    What i could read between the lines here was that some babies where dying outside of the mother. pulled out alive and killed.

  7. #7
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    I hope that's not a common occurrence, but pro-lifers will try to claim it is, regardless of whether or not there is any evidence.
    Several pro-life organizations already do; I admit I lean strongly toward the pro-life position myself, but I find it at least equally believable that its not a common occurance (there are easier and less risky ways for doctors to earn money, and the ideologically committed would be wary of bad publicity to their cause); I do, however, find such suppositions more believable with this news, which fits the narrative. I think some kind of broader investigation is called for, in any event, much as it would be if evidence is found to indicate that state prosecutors withheld evidence supporting a defendants innocence.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    Several pro-life organizations already do; I admit I lean strongly toward the pro-life position myself, but I find it at least equally believable that its not a common occurance (there are easier and less risky ways for doctors to earn money, and the ideologically committed would be wary of bad publicity to their cause); I do, however, find such suppositions more believable with this news, which fits the narrative. I think some kind of broader investigation is called for, in any event, much as it would be if evidence is found to indicate that state prosecutors withheld evidence supporting a defendants innocence.
    I agree that a broader investigation would be a good idea. I think this is probably an isolated case, but if it's not, we have a serious problem.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #9
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    So a few months make the difference between being a doctor and being a murderer. Aside from the high price, I have absolutely no problem with this man's actions. It is a matter of definition when a life beings to be worthy of protection. I fail to see why a baby without any experiences, without any grasp of what it is losing, a being without self-awareness should be protected if no one wants it. In the state of nature, it would die, too.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    So a few months make the difference between being a doctor and being a murderer. I have absolutely no problem with this man's actions. It is a matter of definition when a life beings to be worthy of protection. I fail to see why a baby without any experiences, without any grasp of what it is losing, a being without self-awareness should be protected if no one wants it. In the state of nature, it would die, too.
    In the US, abortion is permitted because the fetus cannot survive outside the mother. That is why late-term abortions are illegal, because the fetus could not survive on its own. Therefore, killing a fetus after 24 weeks, when it has the potential to survive outside the mother, is illegal.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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