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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post
    Thats not neccesairely true...
    You can contort, bend, and flex your way out of my construction, but it doesn't really do any good.

    I made the definitions right there; all you'd really be doing is offering different definitions.

    And, for the purpose I was making, those are worthwhile definitions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post
    ...hence I'de rather make judgements on the information from origin and validity...and find plausability in the arguments made...rather then the character.
    Good luck with that one.

    I forecast this kind of stuff for a living, and, trust me, you never have perfect information.

    You never get certainty; you never get perfect clarity; you're always working based off assumptions; and your assumptions could always be wrong.

    But feel free to believe whatever you want about what's going to happen to the world. I just recommend that you don't mistake it for being factual.

    As for me, when someone is telling me what the future holds, but they can't spell "judgments" correctly, I find them less credible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post
    However Ruppert tends to back things up with actual documentation in his arguments...
    Once again, as someone who does this for a living, I can assure you, there's always evidence for both sides of the argument.

    Merely pointing to some piece of evidence and saying it means such and such, does not mean it means such and such.

    An interpretation is going on there, and many things go into that interpretation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post
    ...but that was not the point of the movie to provide you with such, rather then sparking dialogue in yourself and others.
    I'm not sure whether you know this, but, along with sparking dialogue in yourself and others, the movie was also meant to show Michael Ruppert's isolation, alienation, and loneliness.

    The point of doing so was to show how his beliefs might have contributed to these, and how these might contribute to his beliefs.

    "Collapse" is a double entendre; it can mean either the impending collapse he's predicting, or the collapse of his mind/life due to his obsession with supposed impending collapse.

    Throughout history there have always been people making claims about impending collapse, rapture, apocalypse, second-coming-of-Christ/the 12th Imam/etc.

    If you haven't already, you should read up on millenarianism and related ideas, so that you have a bit more perspective on the matter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post
    Regardless, the movie was a good watch ..regardless of what one thinks of the man
    I agree; it was certainly a good watch.



    (btw, it's available streaming on Netflix, for anyone who's interested...)

  2. #42
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    I am finally back.


    From what I see alot of it has been said bit I still think that you have overkooked some of the most serious consequences.


    Classic nuclear power probably will not be a good replacement. It is true that the process is more efficient than it is used to be but there is a one complication.
    Most people don't talk about it but there somethig called "peak uranium" that should be here a few decades from now. Which means that if we increase uranium consumption multiple times the peak will be here in no time. There is alot of uranium deep in the earth's crust but to get it out you will need more than you will get out of it. So basically this uranium does not exist from our perspective and only the one near surface is the one that counts.

    Plus you have a political problem since moving to nuclear power would mean that every country will become nuclear power/country.
    So to be honest I don't see that happening.




    The hydroelectric dams are good but many countries don't have major rivers. Plus all estimations show further increase in global population. What is somewhat problematic since this energy source will prermanenty flood alot of fertile soil which is next to the rivers. While on the other hand most of these dams would need to be near places of energy consumption. Since otherwise we would have huge loses due to the resistance of matal.


    Solar energy is also good in theory but creating huge amount of them will have huge energy cost since the material has to be mined and properly processed first. While on the other hand you have the same problems as with dams , they will take alot of soil/space , you have to place them near place of consumption to reduce loses etc.
    Since solar panells on the roof would not be able to power your entire home , your car , the food production from your family , transportation for the products you buy, mining operations , metallurgy ..... and everything else you will need.


    Plus you have one additional problem. In places like south eastern USA and Caribbean islands you have problems with hurricanes on regular basis. What means that the solar panells will constantly be at the risk of being destroyed. Leaving the enitre regions of this part of the word uninhabatable for advanced society as we know it today. Since the region will not be able to power up everything it needs.
    So nuclear energy and dams are probably the only thing that can save parts of the world that have hurricane problem(s). (ortherwise there will be alot of refugee's in the future world)


    Changes in military strenght are also very likely. Because just as cars , trucks and cargo ships need oil just the same works for tanks, helicopters, strategic bombers , alot of military ships ... etc. So when the oil gets mostly depleated most countries would not be able to defend their borders. Which means that the big countries that have the resources to change the power source of their military will be the one who will rule to world. While the smaller and/or poorer countries will stay without most of their military strength. Especially when they spent most of the ammo that usually comes from the import anyway.


    Another problem is that the entire petro-dollar thing will be gone. Over the past decades the USA had the luxury of printing money because always it could just "send" it abroad. Since other countries needed it to buy the oil. (what can only be done with dollars) However after peak oil the rules of this game will certainly change. What will lead into huge economic changes across the globe. Since the primary function of the dollar in world will be gone.




    Opinions ?

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arclight View Post
    Someone invented a car engine that runs on water over 40 years ago..
    No they didn't. Not unless the laws of Thermodynamics have been repealed.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    Simply adopt an authoritarian government to implement the process, then overthrow it later. It has been done many times in the past, I see no reason why it would be non-feasible this time around.
    Authoritarian governments cannot overcome economics. They can order that things be built or produced or imported all day long, but if the cash flow doesn't work they're pissing in the wind.

  5. #45
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    Here’s the caption that accompanies that photo:

    Weighing in at 1,250 pounds (567 kilograms), Marina Wilson’s champion steer Grandview Rebel is ready for auction at a county fair in Maryland. Raising this steer has taken an agricultural investment equal to 283 gallons (1,071 liters) of oil, represented here by the red drums. That includes everything from fertilizers on cornfields to the diesel that runs machinery on the farm. Overall, it takes three-quarters of a gallon of oil to produce a pound of beef.

    http://www.energybulletin.net/storie...nd-food-prices
    Bigger article

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  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post

    Here’s the caption that accompanies that photo:

    Weighing in at 1,250 pounds (567 kilograms), Marina Wilson’s champion steer Grandview Rebel is ready for auction at a county fair in Maryland. Raising this steer has taken an agricultural investment equal to 283 gallons (1,071 liters) of oil, represented here by the red drums. That includes everything from fertilizers on cornfields to the diesel that runs machinery on the farm. Overall, it takes three-quarters of a gallon of oil to produce a pound of beef.

    http://www.energybulletin.net/storie...nd-food-prices
    Bigger article

    Well gosh... how did we grow beef before there was oil?

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Well gosh... how did we grow beef before there was oil?
    Well golly, I don't know. We're gonna have to ask our grandparents...but beef will get mighty expensive!

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tantive View Post
    Well golly, I don't know. We're gonna have to ask our grandparents...but beef will get mighty expensive!
    It's getting to be time to move back to dad's farm, I can tell.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon View Post
    Well gosh... how did we grow beef before there was oil?
    On so called "traditional ways".

    But the main problem is not that we can no longer produce beef.
    The problem is that it will be really hard to produce the amount of beef we are producing today.

    Plus even if we somehow succed in that it will take much more people to do that and there will be some serious problems with distribution of beef/food.

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